Man! I was so impressed with WotLK! I haven't even played it yet! I've been trying to install it for an entire day now and I'm just now at 88% complete because I had to download the client installer thing from your website after your DVD decided that it didn't want to install on my system.
I'm really getting sick of spending tons of cash on games and systems these days and having to worry about whether or not they'll even work. I think with new games I've bought within the past three months, I've done more troubleshooting than playing. My PS3's controller sync issues that force me to do a hard shut down any time my controller drops out. Oh wow, I'm really looking forward to sending it off for three weeks and spending $150 to get it fixed. All you XBOX 360 owners out there can't say much either, I mean, red ring of death?
Now I buy Wrath of the Lich King and the dvd doesn't work? Where did that Blizzard quality go? I wanted to play it when I bought it last night, and here I am, almost 24 hours later still trying to install the damn thing on a computer that exceeds the recommended specs and is well taken care of to boot.
Where did the days of Nintendo go? Oh, thats right, developers decided that they'd rather make fat cash on cheaper and poorer quality game systems so they jumped ship back in the 90s. My Wii hasn't had any issues at all! I just wish there was something I wanted to play on the damn thing.
If companies put the kind of effort into a game necessary for it to be reliable 99.9% of the time, each game would cost $500.
Developer =\= Console Manufacturer btw.
For the record, the Wii does have its problems as well...
Sometimes, discs just plain don't load, and you have to restart the console.
It's nothing compared to the problems with the other consoles, but still...
Anthony wrote:Man! I was so impressed with WotLK! I haven't even played it yet! I've been trying to install it for an entire day now and I'm just now at 88% complete because I had to download the client installer thing from your website after your DVD decided that it didn't want to install on my system.I'm really getting sick of spending tons of cash on games and systems these days and having to worry about whether or not they'll even work. I think with new games I've bought within the past three months, I've done more troubleshooting than playing. My PS3's controller sync issues that force me to do a hard shut down any time my controller drops out. Oh wow, I'm really looking forward to sending it off for three weeks and spending $150 to get it fixed. All you XBOX 360 owners out there can't say much either, I mean, red ring of death?
Now I buy Wrath of the Lich King and the dvd doesn't work? Where did that Blizzard quality go? I wanted to play it when I bought it last night, and here I am, almost 24 hours later still trying to install the damn thing on a computer that exceeds the recommended specs and is well taken care of to boot.
Where did the days of Nintendo go? Oh, thats right, developers decided that they'd rather make fat cash on cheaper and poorer quality game systems so they jumped ship back in the 90s. My Wii hasn't had any issues at all! I just wish there was something I wanted to play on the damn thing.
...It's too bad things like Torrent sites don't exist, and they're completely morally unethical and there's absolutely no practical justification for them at all!
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Banon wrote:For the record, the Wii does have its problems as well...Sometimes, discs just plain don't load, and you have to restart the console.
It's nothing compared to the problems with the other consoles, but still...
Never once had an issue like that with my Wii.
take the disc back and say it doesn't work. I've encountered a bad batch of Tekken 5 games before, just gotta return it and if possible, verify the replacement disc works in the store... not sure if you can do that with an online game like WotLK though.
I have had the disc loading issue with the Wii. I think it just needs to be cleaned out, but if I restart the system and then eject/reload the disc is usually works fine after that. Once it reads it right then there are no problems while it's being used, just maybe an issue next time I start it up again.
I've never had any problems with discs, but I have very occasionally experienced my Wii hanging up loading a Wiiware title. Personally, I miss the good old days of the NES, where all problems could be fixed by taking the game out and blowing on it.
Other than that, I understand that as games and systems get more complex, you're going to run into more problems. Back in the day, we didn't have to worry as much about software errors and the like, but that was because games were simpler.
Anthony wrote:
Now I buy Wrath of the Lich King and the dvd doesn't work? Where did that Blizzard quality go? I wanted to play it when I bought it last night, and here I am, almost 24 hours later still trying to install the damn thing on a computer that exceeds the recommended specs and is well taken care of to boot.
franpa wrote:take the disc back and say it doesn't work. I've encountered a bad batch of Tekken 5 games before, just gotta return it and if possible, verify the replacement disc works in the store... not sure if you can do that with an online game like WotLK though.
Just download the frickin' game. I got WoW + TBC for free. From what I've heard Lich King sucks so I don't plan on downloading it.
Hardware issues can be linked to everything being made in China now. Software issues can be linked to the high development costs and probably an increasing amount of developers that don't really know some basic procedures.
If you want a game that will just work you will need to go back to retro consoles. The worst you might have to do is clean a cartridge's contacts.
Welcome to the world of PC gaming. It has been and will always be this way, due to the ridiculous number of combinations of hardware that the software must support. Consoles have a standard configuration and generally use the same components from the same manufacturers with the same level of quality. PCs only provide a standard interface through software abstraction layers; the hardware can come from one of hundreds of different vendors of varying quality. If one piece of the puzzle implements a standard wrong, it will cause a problem in the abstraction.
What's worse, the developers can release a 90% complete game and provide the rest of the 10% (which is usually quality upgrades) through patches. PC owners have paid for broken games for at least a decade now, and they continue to do it. Consoles get a taste of this lately, since downloadable patches give the developers an excuse to force the game out without proper QA. The only way to stop this cycle is to refuse to buy the games. You and I both know this won't happen on a significant scale, because the games are sweet, sweet candy even when flawed.
However, I'm going to apply Occam's Razor and say you probably got a bad disc and should have returned it. If 2 discs failed, I'd start looking for a friend with the disc to see if theirs worked in my machine. If not, I'd look to blaming my DVD drive and look for updated drivers followed by a replacment drive (If so, I'd try my disc in their machine to see if it was a disc problem.) If it fails then, I'd probably set up a VM and see if it installs on that; if so then something's borked in my OS. Only after ruling out the disc, the drive, and the system would I start considering complaining about the manufacturer's quality. The final check would be to search the web for complaints about the disc not working. If there's lots of complaints it's time for pitchforks and torches; if not then I'd assume I'm the unlucky recipient of a manufacturing defect.
It's better to reserve hatred for the truly stupid; one time I bought my 3-year-old (at the time) brother a sweet looking Tonka game for the computer. I put it in the drive, then found out there wasn't a single executable file on the disc; just data files. That's incompetence.
*edit* Also I think Mott's right; hardware quality isn't what it used to be due to strong downward pressure on prices. In general, it takes a fantastic programmer to be a video game developer, but judging from some of the bugs in big-ticket games these days I think there's more demand for employees than good bodies to fill the positions. Talented developers want stable work, which is something the video game industry has not demonstrated in this recession. The net result is too many people who don't know what they're doing are in the video game industry by merit of being the only people to take the position. (This is actually a problem in the industry as a whole; I blame the promise of quick riches and the lack of managers that understand how to judge a programmer's worth. A degree is not a guarantee of talent.)
Didn't you read the box that said, Some Programming Required? 😛
AtmaWeapon wrote:
However, I'm going to apply Occam's Razor and say you probably got a bad disc and should have returned it. If 2 discs failed, I'd start looking for a friend with the disc to see if theirs worked in my machine. If not, I'd look to blaming my DVD drive and look for updated drivers followed by a replacment drive (If so, I'd try my disc in their machine to see if it was a disc problem.) If it fails then, I'd probably set up a VM and see if it installs on that; if so then something's borked in my OS. Only after ruling out the disc, the drive, and the system would I start considering complaining about the manufacturer's quality. The final check would be to search the web for complaints about the disc not working. If there's lots of complaints it's time for pitchforks and torches; if not then I'd assume I'm the unlucky recipient of a manufacturing defect.
I'll be honest, I was hot when I posted that earlier. I'm playing it now and enjoying it. It kind of gets to you when you have several new pieces of gaming technology that don't want to work right requiring more time, work, and money to get them working when they should have been working right from the start.
Oh, and yes Mott, I believe I'll be dusting off the old SNES here in a day or so.
I was thinking about this awhile ago, I miss the days when I could get a game, come home and pop it in with no guff. I'd be so pissed if I was a kid now a days with a PS3. Go and rent or buy a new game and come home hoping to play it for an hour before bed time only to find out its going to take you almost and hour to install the piece of shit. I always forget when I buy a new game too, I get so excited and I have to sit around waiting for installation and patching. Or the 360 I'd feel like I was walking on egg shells, like if I breathed I might have to send it back to get it fixed. Working at a game rental store probably %60 of our income is people renting our X-box because theirs got the red ring.
This is why I've always preferred consoles to computers, instant functionality and reliability. The chances of a console game corrupting, freezing or shutting down was little to nil unless you were jumping or pissing on it. Even then both my NES and Genesis have survived a number of floods (my genesis has been completely submerged for hours twice) and drops down stairs and both work like a dream.
I do sometimes wonder - I've got my NES which is upwards of 20 years old, and it still works. What are the odds of a 360 working 20 years from now? Also, kinda makes me think - given the changes between the NES and now, I can't imagine what gaming will be like in 20 years.
rock_nog wrote:I do sometimes wonder - I've got my NES which is upwards of 20 years old, and it still works. What are the odds of a 360 working 20 years from now? Also, kinda makes me think - given the changes between the NES and now, I can't imagine what gaming will be like in 20 years.
Easy, Nintendo will die, because EVERYONE feels like suing them.
Sony will die, because even when people buy their products they lose money.
Microsoft will... ummm... Have a red hollow sphere of death...? Maybe...?
Wait, never mind, that's just the next generations agenda...
Rock_nog, good point, but to be fair, I must point out that an NES is a lot simpler than an XBOX 360—it has less complicated hardware and less, if any, software to get fucked up. As for your second point, I can't help but think that there's going to be some kind of awesomeness asymptote. Things will keep getting better, but only a little bit at a time. Eventually any scalar improvement over the previous generation will be negligible, and developers will spend more time working on innovation instead.
On the note of consoles being less reliable, also keep in mind that disc-based consoles have moving parts, where cartridge-based ones didn't. With the NES, the connectors just had to match up. But now with the newer consoles, you have a disc drive that has to spin, a laser that has to be aligned perfectly, and fans that should be cooling everything.
What if we just had a huge ass lens, and you put the CD disc on top of it, and that was that? No spinning, no anything. Just a big fucking lens, and the top of the cd connects to the lid, thus holding it in place.
Someone tell me why that wouldn't work.
The lens of the laser emits a beam that has to hit a Pit or Land (1 or 0) on the disc surface. A huge lens wouldn't help at all. In theory though, you could devise an optical disc reader that doesn't require spinning of the disc. But that would require R&D costs. The current method is fine.
Why can't they just print all the ones and zeros on a piece of paper, and stick a midget in a box, the midget reads the paper, ????, profit? It will work, I'm telling ya.
Then you'd have to pay the midget. Midgets are a callous people. ;(
you'd undoubtedly get step 2 from putting a midget in a box, but not so much profit.
[quote="Modus Ponens"]Things will keep getting better, but only a little bit at a time. Eventually any scalar improvement over the previous generation will be negligible, and developers will spend more time working on innovation instead.[/quote]
Once scalers and resolutions stop affecting things by notable amounts, they will move to true 3d. We already have true 3d computer monitors and TV's.
Shazza Dani wrote:Why can't they just print all the ones and zeros on a piece of paper, and stick a midget in a box, the midget reads the paper, ????, profit? It will work, I'm telling ya.
That might actually make the PS3 smaller.
Anthony wrote:That might actually make the PS3 smaller.
Game over. New thread.
There is a theory that is actually what they did with the original XBox controller...
I loved the original xbox controller, but then again I'm not a small handed mentally incompetent whine-o-matic.
Beldaran wrote:I loved the original xbox controller, but then again I'm not a small handed mentally incompetent whine-o-matic.
I never owned an original XBox controller...I was just trying to make a clever joke. 😞
I failed. I'm sorry.
Beldaran wrote:I loved the original xbox controller, but then again I'm not a small handed mentally incompetent whine-o-matic.
Neither am I, and I disliked it.
I never held an original Xbox controller, but I imagine I wouldn't like it since the 360 controller is perfect for me.
That thing is a monster.