Hasn't it been enough?!

koopa wrote:We'd of course have to have basic and advanced tutorials, some for making quests without scripts (like the ones we already have) and others for learning zscript (like the one I've started writing).

It sounds to me like.... maybe their are just some things people like and want and some things people don't like and want.

I for one hate to script, god.. no scripting, i loved ZC because you did not have things like that.

What should have been done is someone should have looked at RPG maker 2000 or 2003, scripting was done by way of events, events were triggered when you A touched it B got right over it or C walked up against it and pressed a button.

And their was no typing needed to do scripting that way, it was all point and click.

I loved that.

I do not want to script... BUT... and this is a BIG BUT, this way others who do know about scripting can share their scripts, and that would be cool.

As for bugs, only time i have any major bugs is.... WHEN i import a quest from and older version.

If i start one fresh in the newer version i don't get a bunch of bugs popping up.
Only bug im still having is really odd and i have no idea what may be causing it, Zelda classic itself turns reds and the pallets go all wacko, but the colors are actually still the same colors they are supposed to be when you save and play the quest... it is really bizarre.

I love the sub screen editor, i almost pooped my pants when i seen that was added lol.

Oh and more then one warp, that awesome to.
Link being bigger and taller is awesome, but his sword sits wrong with the big link.

My thing is this, IF you do not like a feature, DON'T use it.
I mean, i hate scripting, so guess what.
..................................................... I WONT USE IT.

Thank you for your time everyone have a good day, i need some sleep, im sitting her all night the last few nights looking for bugs, but i can not find one that someone has not already beat me to reporting.

I think the main point of this thread is basically not hating on ZC's new features, but concentrating on bugs. I welcome all of these ZC features, even if I don't use things like scripts. Why? Because, someone would be able to use them and make great games with these features.

The developer's have said that they are going to add a few more features like the dialogue editor, however, focus on bugs and make sure that there is a stable release in December. The thing is I think people are getting freaked out that there is basically 2 months left, and beta 14, the last beta, was very buggy. They haven't released beta 15 yet, and if there are those new features, bugs will come in. Will they be able to make the deadline? I am not so sure since we don't know a lot of what is going on behind closed doors. I say once we get beta 15, we can figure if they will or not.

But yeah, my exceptations of ZC are high; I want all of the 2.10 games to play perfectly. I want my quest HoD to be able to played all of the way through with no bugs. The reason is, I want people to be able to play it on 2.11, without that midi bug. I was so mad that there was no fix for 2.10. Please just make sure you release a near-perfect beta, and I will play through HoD, in it to see if it plays perfectly. Don't release the version just to make the deadline, kill all of the bugs first. It is better to have a stable, non-buggy release then a month early version.

It is better to have a stable, non-buggy release then a month early version.

you couldn't of said it better. I want a stable version, not some buggy stuff.

Which reminds me, is that stupid map bug and that heart container bug fixed yet? I have heard no word on that yet.

So you are doing one after all? I started on one, but it's not too far along yet (only up to mathematical operators). I'll let you have what there is, if it'll help.

The manual is a separate piece of work that should be done a lot sooner.

Regarding making Zquest Basic/Advanced, that won't solve the problem of bugs in the actual ZC player. A stable version means to me one you can play without it bugging up, and if there's a bug in, say, the item system that'll need to be fixed whether scripts come into it or not.

Well imo I think it hasn't got complicated at all. If you are just new to zc. You can still use the basic features to make a decent quest. But if you want to be more advanced then you can make use of the newer things.

Seanbox344 wrote:Well imo I think it hasn't got complicated at all. If you are just new to zc. You can still use the basic features to make a decent quest. But if you want to be more advanced then you can make use of the newer things.

Exactly. The idea of ZC is that you can make a quest without all of these features. They're just there so you have the option to make a cooler quest. You can still make a quest in 3 days. It's just that the expectations now are higher.

Yeah, which means that few people will make one in 3 days, because the expectations are high. When everyone else is making quests with the features, youll use them too even if you dont want to, because everyone else is doing it, and you feel you have to compare. Peer pressure.

Why not just make it for an earilier version then?

People loooove their multiwarps. ;-p

Well, we could always have contests for this sort of thing.

"You have 72 hours to make a quest with 3 dungeons that uses the following items and the included tileset."

"Make a quest with 4 dungeons using only overworld-type dmaps."

"Make a quest with as many strange elements as you can think of (such as zoras appearing on land or not getting any weapons until you beat a dungeon)."

etc.

There's still life left in 2.10. Which is why I'm fixing bugs in it now.

Maybe the time has come for a whole new Zelda Classic, like Zelda LttP Classic, one that is more suited to higher quality tiles and is able to support an overall larger and more potent game, perhaps something along the lines of Zelda Classic meets RPG Maker, having essentially unlimited colors so you don't have palette issues, being able to add as many enemies and such as you want, scrolling screens.

Basically get this version of ZC completely stable, then instead of upgrading an outdated engine, begin a new one with much more power.

Warlock wrote:If the new features are too complex, *don't use them*. They are not mandatory. You can still make a quest the same way you did with older versions.

Now, I always see that if a quest uses classic graphics, people are turned off. If a quest doesn't make use of <insert new awesome feature here>, people won't play it. The program has really evolved into something spectacular, I fully agree. Some features are too complex for the normal user to use, and their aspiring quests are snubbed because they don't make full use of all the resources.

Long story short, if you don't use the great features, your quest basically gets shit on.

That's exactly what I said. People will use features they don't want because they know that everyone else is, and they feel they have to keep up.

I disagree with the statement that 1.90 was more stable than 1.92 beta 183/184. Version 1.90 had plenty of problems. And if we start talking about non-fatal bugs, like broken enemy movement patterns, 1.90 was just full of 'em.

2.11 Beta 14 and 15 are certainly problematic, but beta 11 is actually pretty darn stable for an "unstable release."

Also, I say the subscreen editor IS user-friendly. I don't even want to touch scripting and FFCs at this point, but I was able to pick up the subscreen editor and run with it. If you want to criticize how "crashy" it is, you would be correct, but don't list it among the non-user-friendly features, because I appreciate it greatly as a feature that can be learned as you go.

And as others have pointed out before, it is completely optional. If you find yourself unable to resist using new features, it's not the programmers fault if you take the time to learn them. It's only a problem if learning them in an unavoidable requirement for using the program.

Now, I always see that if a quest uses classic graphics, people are turned off. If a quest doesn't make use of <insert new awesome feature here>, people won't play it. The program has really evolved into something spectacular, I fully agree. Some features are too complex for the normal user to use, and their aspiring quests are snubbed because they don't make full use of all the resources.

Long story short, if you don't use the great features, your quest basically gets shit on.

Otherwise, there's always romhacking.