The Dimentio and Anarchy Show

[Dimentio]

Not sure what you mean by review bombing @Gleeok . I legit played the quest, and I thought it was hot garbage. Apparently disliking one """type B""" quest (tbh it's neither really type A nor B) means you dislike all of them. This conflict is starting to bore me anyways, since Anarchy's going to keep on acting like a child like he did by ratings bombing my quests, and ratings bombing videos on our collab channel, while trying to ignore/outright remove criticism by deleting ratings/reviews off his quest. Anything he does is going to be predictable, and I already made the post calling him out, and everyone who hated him has already chimed in at this point because of it.

The only good thing that's come out of this (besides the funny temper tantrums Anarchy keeps throwing) is the fact that General Bitching was revived, and thus showing that AGN is only active when you're allowed to bitch about shit publically.

[Anarchy_Balsac]

@Gleeok : Wasn't really going to post in here again and I don't intend on having this post spark a argument, I just want to clarify that I genuinely had played at least half of the quest and gave a review back on the year it was released. It was only until last year I requested all my reviews to be deleted because 2/3 of them were pretty bad and outdated. I was writing up an actual review after playing it and I have the notepad to prove it, I was writing something fairly large and tend to have a habit of leaving a rating before I post a review since I do take a bit of time with them and because PureZC treats ratings and reviews separately. Now was a 0 extreme? In retrospect, yeah. I probably would of bumped it to a 1 if I could post the review due to proper reflection after writing the review down. But I'm not going to admit something that wasn't my intent because frankly, I don't even know Anarchy personally enough to dislike him, I just think uploading that video was a dick move and merely wanted to point that out since it was the right thing to do. Now can you please not drag me into this nonsense again? This isn't even about the reviews at this rate. I only joined this nonsense for shitposts but more importantly because I wanted to clarify that Anarchy uploaded a video of an innocent person who doesn't even know what's going on and got sidetracked by some type a/type b nonsense. If you wanna believe I review bombed, that's perfectly fine, I don't blame anyone who'd think that but I was going to post that review if the quest remained public. I will however will be no longer taking part in this nonsense if that makes you feel any better as I had been doing prior to this. Sorry for the long post, but I really wanted to clarify on a misunderstanding here, it was an easy conclusion to jump to so I take some blame, but I didn't anticipate that I wasn't going to be able to post my review.

Also as a side note, Anarchy called out one of the nicest people in the ZC community, calling him an idiot a month or so ago and admitted that he tried to get his rating (2 stars, I think) and well thought out review removed on his other quest showing that this is more about negative ratings in general than review bombing.

Show me where I admitted trying to get someone's review removed, and where I called said person out.

Not sure what you mean by review bombing @Gleeok . I legit played the quest, and I thought it was hot garbage. Apparently disliking one """type B""" quest (tbh it's neither really type A nor B) means you dislike all of them. This conflict is starting to bore me anyways, since Anarchy's going to keep on acting like a child like he did by ratings bombing my quests, and ratings bombing videos on our collab channel, while trying to ignore/outright remove criticism by deleting ratings/reviews off his quest. Anything he does is going to be predictable, and I already made the post calling him out, and everyone who hated him has already chimed in at this point because of it.

The only good thing that's come out of this (besides the funny temper tantrums Anarchy keeps throwing) is the fact that General Bitching was revived, and thus showing that AGN is only active when you're allowed to bitch about shit publically.

YOU posted several long winded meltdowns in this thread, and spent WEEKS downvoting my youtube videos. EVERY video I posted to youtube had a thumbs down WITHIN MINUTES (which means someone [you] was refreshing the page all day, every day in order to do so). And it started happening right about the time Chris Miller told you to shut up in my Let's Play thread. But of course, for spending 30 minutes doing it back to you for ONE day, I'M the obsessed one.

[Dimentio]

Literally the only video I've disliked is one LP video you made. I'm not the only person who dislikes your content, and I have better things to do than wasting my time downvoting every single video you've ever made, so stop being delusional, kthx.

[James24]

In my book, Anarchy's quest is 100% true blue type B and there can be no doubt about it. Fits the definition to the letter. The root problem is that type A and type B did not understand each other and this lead to a conflict.

Anarchy had the wrong expectations of the audience - he did not understand the type A and type B dichotomy and expected an audience full of type B players. The actual audience for ZC is full of type A players and if you write a type B quest then its going to be rejected by type A players. If you want type A acceptance, then you follow type A rules when you make your quest: lots of focus on beauty and graphics, low to zero challenge, lots of puzzles, no rupee grinding, no arbitrary secrets, no cheap nerfs and making fun of the audience if they use those nerfs etc... If you choose not to follow these rules then your quest will get rated 0 stars, it will get review bombed, it will have a very low fanbase and you'd better be prepared for this kind of thing.

Also, if Shane and Dimentio knew about the type A and type B dichotomy, they would have known that this was a quest that wasn't meant for them. That they weren't the target audience. The weren't the ones Anarchy was trying to appease and would have just moved on to the next quest without playing, rating or reviewing the quest. I recently played Shane's quest and I don't like it, but I respect that I am not the target audience so I simply don't rate it. But no, we have to have this conflict because people don't understand about the divide. Hopefully we can all learn from this and be wiser the next time.

[Dimentio]

IMO Difficulty + ugly tileset != instant type B quest. Type B quests have a certain beauty to them, in that the challenge itself is the puzzle. Liberation of Hyrule, you had to learn the enemy patterns, you had to know when oto take damage and when not to. At it's core, Liberation of Hyrule was a puzzle quest, a very sadistic one mind you, and it used it's challenge beautifully to craft the ultimate puzzle. Armageddon Quest was the same way, but where you needed to go next wasn't spelled out for you like Liberation, and you were given more leniency with what you were allowed to do at certain times. Dungeon Impossible had the puzzle of figuring out how you were supposed to take on each room. "The Most Difficult Quest Ever Created TM" was the same type of puzzle as Liberation.

That puzzle is the true core of Type B quests. Type A players prefer different types of puzzles, but at the core, both types are puzzle focused.

Please tell me, where's the puzzle in Anarchy's Quests? Figuring out the creator wants you to kill 50000 enemies to get enough rupees to proceed through his arbitrary requirements? He could have put a gauntlet or a minidungeon to get those required items, but instead he chose to go with forced grinding! He could have removed the grinding/shops entirely and the quest would be better for it! Instead of me going "He expects me to grind up 200 rupees for a hookshot and shield before level 1? WTF!?", I'd be going "He expects me to take this challenge on with only the wooden sword? All right, bring it on!". By having them there, he dangles this easier option in front of you and tells you "hey, you're supposed to have these at this point! GrindGrindGrind! Bore you out of your mind!" and it's like come on, Type B quests don't dangle the easy option in front of you! Type B quests don't tempt you with cheap nerfs! Just give the required items when you absolutely need them for free, unless you have a dungeon or dungeon segment revolving around grinding like Liberation of Hyrule, but even then too much of those can be boring!

I think it's probably very clear at this point that forced grinding is a huuuuuge pet peeve of mine and pretty much an instant -1 star at the very least

[Shane]

Show me where I admitted trying to get someone's review removed, and where I called said person out.

Quoted from 6th Quest Invitational thread:

The most annoying thing is when some idiot one stars your quest for being too hard, or because they were too dumb to figure out that they ventured out to a part that they lacked the gear to explore without getting outright clobbered, and the admins at pure do nothing about it. It's quite irritating.

"The admins at pure do nothing about it" clearly means you expected them to remove or at the very least change it even though it was a well thought out review by one of the nicest people you'll ever meet in the ZC community. At the time of this post, only his review was on one of your quests so the call out was obvious. And even then you flamed this guy, pretty much insulting his skills showing this is more than just " review-bombing ". I said more than I needed to. I requested to be not dragged into this any further previously, I will be just not answering at this point. Apologies for the serious posts.

[Gleeok]

@Gleeok : Wasn't really going to post in here again and I don't intend on having this post spark a argument, I just want to clarify that I genuinely had played at least half of the quest and gave a review back on the year it was released. It was only until last year I requested all my reviews to be deleted because 2/3 of them were pretty bad and outdated. I was writing up an actual review after playing it and I have the notepad to prove it, I was writing something fairly large and tend to have a habit of leaving a rating before I post a review since I do take a bit of time with them and because PureZC treats ratings and reviews separately. Now was a 0 extreme? In retrospect, yeah. I probably would of bumped it to a 1 if I could post the review due to proper reflection after writing the review down. But I'm not going to admit something that wasn't my intent because frankly, I don't even know Anarchy personally enough to dislike him, I just think uploading that video was a dick move and merely wanted to point that out since it was the right thing to do. Now can you please not drag me into this nonsense again? This isn't even about the reviews at this rate. I only joined this nonsense for shitposts but more importantly because I wanted to clarify that Anarchy uploaded a video of an innocent person who doesn't even know what's going on and got sidetracked by some type a/type b nonsense. If you wanna believe I review bombed, that's perfectly fine, I don't blame anyone who'd think that but I was going to post that review if the quest remained public. I will however will be no longer taking part in this nonsense if that makes you feel any better as I had been doing prior to this. Sorry for the long post, but I really wanted to clarify on a misunderstanding here, it was an easy conclusion to jump to so I take some blame, but I didn't anticipate that I wasn't going to be able to post my review.

Also as a side note, Anarchy called out one of the nicest people in the ZC community, calling him an idiot a month or so ago and admitted that he tried to get his rating (2 stars, I think) and well thought out review removed on his other quest showing that this is more about negative ratings in general than review bombing.

Thanks Shane for the clarification. I appreciate it. Yes, you may now go back to frolicking in greener pastures. (purezc joke? You decide.)

And you have to admit that multiple 0-ratings on a complete full-length quest to start this shit off is a big giant red flag that needed to be addressed. Especially considering that 0-ratings are reserved for quests that don't work or are unplayable. Also the fact that to actually play through half of a full-length quest so terrible you deem worthy of giving 0-stars makes absolutely zero sense. You can see why the whole thing seems suspect.

[Dimentio]

0 Stars only recently became """reserved""" for broken shit, and I frankly don't give a shit that it's """reserved"""". Having broken shit be reserved to 0 star ratings is absurd, so I'll just keep using the 0 star as it used to be: For incredibly shitty quests.

Also, I played through a decent portion of the quest, and no other quest I've played came to terms of how thoroughly unenjoyable it was. Given that I've rated other quests 0 stars, and this was the least enjoyable quest I've ever played, it made sense to, ya know, not rate it higher than the other quests I enjoyed more than it.

Though let's be completely frank, this thread was never about his quest. Me insulting his "masterpiece" was just the icing on the cake. If he was a sane human being, he would have just accepted my rating. Instead, he threw a hissy fit and overreacted. Basically, he became a Puzzledude. Congrats! That's why I'm a bit insulted that this is being boiled down to a "type A/B issue". It's not. This thread is about my personal beef with Anarchy, and given that this started by him responding to my polite post over in his LP thread with essentially "fuck off", me rating his quest poorly isn't the core of the issue here. It's purely out of my contempt for what a miserable piece of human filth Anarchy is. Now please, can we stop with the "Type A/B" shit? We can easily make another thread for it if we want to discuss it, but this thread, nor the issues here, have barely anything to do with my or his quest preferences.

[James24]

A strict reading and interpretation of my original definition confirms that Anarchy's quest is a type B quest:

Type B players are the exact opposite of type A and they like very challenging quests with high difficulty and the rest of the quest including graphics, puzzles, storyline is a nice bonus but isn't very important.

Only the high difficulty part needs to be satisfied and no one can deny that Zelda 3 indeed does have high difficulty. Plus, it does not have to include puzzles. Puzzles aren't very important - they are purely optional. If you want to expand the definition to include puzzles then that will be your type B definition - not my original. Plus, Liberation of Hyrule's puzzles are difficulty/combat related. Not only do you have to initially figure out what you need to do, but to actually pull them off takes a fair amount of skill and is quite difficult, which is in stark contrast to type A puzzles. And finally, I had no intention to ever make Liberation a puzzle quest. Its not a puzzle quest - yes, you need to be very smart about how you fight at times but it wasn't meant to be a puzzle - more of a statement that type B players aren't just robots that are good at fighting, we have brains too.

Also, forced grinding does not exclude a quest from being type B according to my original definition. I have to somewhat agree with you on this one, it makes the difficulty ambiguous since a player can artificially make the quest easier by grinding for items - a cheap nerf more or less. But is it truly forced grinding? Can the quest be played with no grinding regardless of the author's intentions? Take for example Armageddon Quest, you can choose to grind for keys to make things artificially easy, or you can play OUCH's true hard mode with no grinding but you'll face the full fury of his monsters and dungeons unleashed. Insanely hard but possible without too much luck to a highly skilled type B player. From what I've played of Zelda 3 (up to the third dungeon), the game is possible to play without any forced rupee grinding but it takes a lot of skill. Are you 100% sure you've got the forced grinding part right Dimentio??

Finally, type A/type B goes to the very heart of your beef with Anarchy so I don't see why you find it irrelevant. If both you and Anarchy had understood and accepted the dichotomy before you had played, none of this conflict would be occurring.

[Gleeok]

James24 wins this thread.






This kind of ties in to Type A/B personality traits which explains why Type A players are more likely to get angry and rage-quit. Of course the game must be flawed or the game designer is being cheap and unfair. They are doing gods work and rating the quest poorly as to expose this great injustice done unto them.

Finally, type A/type B goes to the very heart of your beef with Anarchy so I don't see why you find it irrelevant. If both you and Anarchy had understood and accepted the dichotomy before you had played, none of this conflict would be occurring.

They didn't understand.