[5th Quest Entry] Nightmare

[sctmorgan]

Thanks so much for the help...but I have to say my quest is different. I can't recall when I downloaded the quest but the filename is 5thquest.qst.

[bigboylink]

Very fun quest to play and a solid contender for the winner (I do anticipate having time to play through all of the entries). My playtime for this quest was 13 hours with 19 deaths (and a bunch of restarts).

Some quick bugs/errors to report:

(1) Level 7 - In the room one east of the triforce room, pushing the block does not make a stairway appear.
(2) Similar bug - in level 5, four screens west of the triforce, pushing the block does not make a stairway appear. So if you missed the boss key, you're forced to quit/continue.
(3) Similar bug in level 9 - in the room one north + one east of the entrance.
(4) Another moving block bug in level 9 - 3 rooms east of the top-left corner, after killing the manhandla, pushing the block does not make a stairway appear.
(5) I think someone else already pointed these out but I still experienced them on the most recent download - (a) there's nothing on the Quest1-Level6 screen. (b) Entering the cave on the screen of Quest1-Level2 gets you stuck in level 3.
(6) In level 6, the string "west of old letter two" is repeated from earlier. This isn't a bug, but its existence seemed unintentional.
(7) On the "old letter two" screen, the stairway that appears is a black tile.

Here are some suggestions for improvement. Most of these are minor and don't detract too much from the quest.

(1) It wasn't obvious to me that the Moblin giving you the big wallet was actually giving you the big wallet. He only says "Mo money, mo money"; that combined with the item tile being a purple rupee led me to infer that the Moblin was in fact giving me rupees. Since I had close to 255 rupees at the time, I didn't pick up the item, since I wanted to save it for any possible later purchases. All of that said, I really like the addition of having the big wallet in this quest (and its use in levels 7-8).
(2) In level 7,

Spoiler: show

I found pushing all of the blocks to find the boss key to be tedious. I think it would be a better choice to put the boss key near the end of the level, in the room where fighting three yellow darknuts reveals a passage that gives you 200 rupees.

(3) In level 1, before getting the sword it wasn't obvious to me that there was a stairway in the dark room with the Aquamentus.
(4) The stalfos sword beams only give 1 heart of damage; why not the original two hearts?
(5) I'm having a hard time trying to decide if the quest should lose "NES-authenticity" points for having bushes and graves in dungeons. Having to bomb the column of graves in level 4 felt even less intuitive and less "NES-authentic". I'm wondering if your string "Rules wre meant to be broken" might ruffle some feathers.
(6) Regarding level 9 -

Spoiler: show

I'm not a fan of giving the red candle so late in the game; the biggest gripe is that it makes exploring in the overworld a chore with only the blue candle. I anticipate that this comment is likely to apply to not just Nightmare's entry.

Case in point - I believe that in LoveForFire's 4th quest entry, before it was combined with QuestWizard's dungeons, the red candle was given in level 1 for exactly the purpose of exploring what someone else has previously described as "the exploration quest" (as contrasted with Alphadawg's "combat quest"). Consequently, switching the red candle with the power bracelet was a very poor design choice, in my humble opinion. Indeed the first and second quests provided the red candle late in the game; however, one of the reasons that Zelda 1 has not aged well (outside the ZC community) is due to the perceived tedious overworld exploration with bombs and the blue candle. As one component of showcasing the 5th quest as an evolution from the first and second quests, the ZC community should be mindful of such perceived conerns of tedium.

So I think you should consider having another item open the entrance to level 9. Perhaps the silver arrow? I know that using the candle to burn the big tree might seem more natural, but freeing the red candle early, say in level 2, also has these advantages that (imo) outweigh that:

(a) Making exploration of level 2 easier.
(b) There's a room early in level 6 where you have to burn a bush to reveal a passage. Trying to figure this out with the blue candle is tedious. (Again, I think you lose "NES-authenticity" points for bushes in dungeons.)

(7) Another level 9 spoiler -

Spoiler: show

Since Ganon in quest 4 takes more than 4 hits, it would seem inconsistent if he only takes 4 hits in quest 5. Again, this comment is likely to apply to not just Nightmare's entry.

PS - What does the "x" clue in the waterfall indicate? I wasn't able to figure that out.

Again, this is all-in-all a solid quest. I really like the use of yellow/purple bubbles, especially with dodongos. The modifications to the overworld enemies are thoughtful (red tektikes with more health, blue moblins giving slightly more damage). Dungeon design is superb, seriously; levels 7 and 8 were very fun to play. Late-game goriyas that are immune to the boomerang is a great touch.

Playing these quests has gotten me nostalgic for the early ZC quests. This is a shot in the dark, but here goes - does anyone have links to the 3rd quest entries for Glenn the Great and TSA? (can't find any links on Pure nor zeldaclassic.com).

Sorry for the long-ish post; I hope you find it constructive and useful.

[Nightmare]

Well, with Glenn dead, it's going to be hard to get his 3rd, but this project is combining his Unofficial 4th with a small tribute to DN:

http://www.purezc.net/index.php?page=projects&id=94

If you're interested in playing some stuff.

TSA fell off the map ever since SDA discovered he was segmenting runs and video editing them. I have not seen him.

-James

[Nightmare]

Edit: Changed the bugs, and made an update to the candles. The Blue Candle now is unlimited, the red does more damage and opens Level 9.

I can always take this out if I get bitched at, but I wonder if this will make some people happier :: cough :: Gleeok :: cough ::

-James

[Nightmare]

I am testing a new version starting later tonight:

I have:
1. Made a new enemy group for Level 4. It's not on the NES, but it's the "Undead Enemy Group" featuring Stalfos, Gibdos, and Ghinis as its main features.
2. I have removed all the bushes in dungeons. Have fun with the bomb blocks in their places.
3. Cleaned up some random enemy groups in certain areas so they conform better, left Lv. 6's Darknuts on purpose so you have something to refill Hearts with there since I can't adjust floating Wizzrobe firing rates.

I'll hopefully be posting this before the deadline, but I want to run through and make sure none of the tile overhaul left residue bugs.

-James

[Gleeok]

If you're changing stuff around still: My biggest irk was the quantity of linear paths in dungeons, which works well for new quest but not as much an NES quest [where there are a lot of rooms *cough].

I think I mentioned all that stuff to you a while back but at the time you weren't changing anything.

[Nightmare]

If you're changing stuff around still: My biggest irk was the quantity of linear paths in dungeons, which works well for new quest but not as much an NES quest [where there are a lot of rooms *cough].

I think I mentioned all that stuff to you a while back but at the time you weren't changing anything.

That I see no reason to: Most people seem to like my dungeons so far with the exception of 5.

BTW, changed the Candle thing to a Gold Candle. CJC and I found a workaround for the Blue Candle thing. You'll enjoy this one Gleeok.

-James

[Nightmare]

Updated

https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/...hnightmare.zip

1. Blue, Red, and Gold Candles now. All behave as Candles do in Zelda, though the Gold does more damage and opens a secret
2. Forest and Graves taken out of the Underworld. I really thought they added a touch, but this did not go over well, so they're gone. Have fun with the Bomb Blocks in their place.
3. Blue Like-Likes adjusted so that they eat Rupees at a more threatening pace and they're not so wimpy.
4. Ganon's HP doubled, he takes 8 hits (I will not boost him more, you don't have a Master Sword in this quest).

The only thing bothering me is that 9 is still kinda easy. Do you think I should buff the enemies more?

-James

[zcfan27330]

I beat it, but maybe on a older version. Had to watch some youtube to get things.

[Nightmare]

Fixed some bugs.

Please redownload.

-James