[5th Quest Entry] Shoelace

[Shoelace]

Here is my 5th quest entry. I fixed the 2nd Level, so I hope the quest up to the rules of the contest. If not, I hope you all enjoy the quest. It is the NES style with a little bit of Shoelace favor. And the Kool-aid is good. :P

http://www.purezc.net/index.php?page=download&section=Quests&id=440

Please let me know if you have any questions, bugs, or are just stuck in a level.

[Gleeok]

Is it down for everybody, or just me? The paradox here is that if it was down for everybody then how did you aquire the page link> ...Dun dun dun. :P

I'll download it as soon as my interwebbing service servers can contact each other and get together for brunch sometime.

[Imzogelmo]

It's not just you, I can't seem to get it either.
EDIT: all of Purezc is down, so go to http://www.celestialrealm.net/ and get it from there.

[peteandwally]

This was pretty fun up to level 4. The flashing screen effect wasn't fun for me and added little difficulty. Then, in level 5 I kept running out of bombs and would have to circle around 5 screens to get some more and then make my way back. I got through most of the dungeon and hit a point where I needed a key, but man... I can't keep wandering around in circles. All that said, this is a solid quest and the scripting and puzzles where good overall. Now that I have the whistle, it'll be easier to get around and find stuff, but I think you should add a shop or two that sells extra keys, even for 200 rupees to limit how many people get.

[Shoelace]

The map is very needed in Level 5, as it shows where and how to get to which rooms. There is an bomb upgrade in level 5 as well.

But what's funny, is you said that the scripts are good so far in the game. I only have two scripts. One is for statues, so that they shoot less frequently and they will only shot when you stab your sword. The other is for level 6. Those are the only scripts in the game. :P

[Love For Fire]

Lots of combo cycling for the Level 4 and 7 effects right? What about how you lit a room and then it would get dark again and you'd have to use the candle again?

[Shoelace]

Is it was all combo cycling. With the rooms I did that would be lit and go dark again were tiered combos. ;)

[peteandwally]

wow, that's pretty cool. I didn't know you could do stuff like that with cycling.

[Imzogelmo]

I think I found a bug. I'm looking for a key, and if this isn't a bug, it's awfully cruel...

http://www.anony.ws/i/2013/11/21/bAXgz.png

Also, your shooter script, is it a public or private? I really like how they only shoot when you stab, it makes me have to plan my moves a bit.

[Shoelace]

It is definitely a bug... I think it was because the room used to have a special item but I instead turned it into a passageway. I wonder why no one ever caught that. lol.

I fixed it thank you.

Also, I will ask Moosh since it is his script, but I am pretty sure, he doesn't mind making it public. So I will get back to you. :)

[Love For Fire]

Level 6 is so evil. Reminds me of Donkey Kong Country 3

[justin1]

I think I found a bug. I'm looking for a key, and if this isn't a bug, it's awfully cruel...

http://www.anony.ws/i/2013/11/21/bAXgz.png




i saw this bug as well. the room above has a key that you probably already got. the key still ends up appearing in the passageway after. i can't remember exactly, but i think i had to revert to my save because i ran out of keys.

[CJC]

Voting is now open for this quest. Vote for as many categories as you please, but be sure to vote before tax day!

Also, please post in this thread stating which categories you selected and explaining why you picked those categories.

[Three Pendants]

Well, I'm a big fan of your work so let's see what's new about your vision of the 5th Quest...

Nice use of greenery in an NES tileset for Level 1.

Ah a path puzzle in Level 1. Nice touch.

Ringmaster, eh? Quite rare to see in ZC Quests.

Haha! Wow! Really fast, what looked to be Death Knights running around really made me double take. But they go down in one hit. A pretty neat idea.

Red Candle right off the bat, eh? I'll enjoy this!

Invisible path through trees, hmm? Very nice.

Hmm, messing up the Boss Key Puzzle and then having to go back to the Moblin room is a little annoying.

The idea of a false Level 2 is really neat and the Gleeok is a nasty surprise indeed!

Took me... more tries than I'd like to admit but he finally went down. The Raft is a nice reward though.

And with the Raft I went to where Level 5 normally would be (I think?) and got a "choose this or that" room. I don't know... I can't see why Anyone would ever choose the Red Potion over a Heart Container. Maybe if it was more balanced like... Wallet Upgrade vs. Heart Container or new Sword vs. Heart Container, but those things always seemed unbalanced to me.

So many Door Repair Charge's in this quest...

Ah, secret shop with affordable Magic Shield... and bait, hmm... buy this or search out the Blue Ring... I guess I'll go with this.

Pay me and I'll talk? Here's to hoping you actually made them say useful things...

Second dungeon seems rather interesting so far. I especially liked the block puzzle where you have to stand on the off color tile to get the block to activate.

Heh, overly complicated raft paths... where would we be without them? In any case I finally have the Boomerang! It was a very interesting play style though to rely on the Candle.

Dungeon 2 was pretty fun, I enjoyed the Leever theme going on there. Nothing too complicated in many respects.

Oh hey! The White Sword! Neat spot for it, not out of the way, but not obvious either.

Level 3 is Shiny, eh? Interesting idea. Oh, it's Ice.

I am so grateful for these bubble rooms. It's like you realized that fighting is fine and all, but repeat fights is a bit monotonous so to simulate a clear trigger you put Bubbles as the first enemy.

I was a little confused on what to do with the fireball-sword swing room, then I struck the statue. In retrospect it made sense.

Ouch... you force people to use Bombs on repeated puzzles? That seems a bit heavy handed in some respects.

I'm not so sure I like the idea of a puzzle based around the trap glitch (where the traps will slide right through)

And the Ladder is secured! I'm not so sure that killing the Keese to get out of the block surrounding on the way back is the best idea. The original game ordinarily placed you outside of the block circle so that wouldn't happen.

(Has too much money and leaves dungeon to see what "Pay me and I'll talk!" has to say.

-10 Not enough Rupees to say anything.
-30 Very useful hint indeed!
-50 Sigh....

Hmm, a sequence of blocks... I wonder if this will be useful to recall for later?

And it was. Interesting little puzzle.

Were those Bats in that one Ladder Room? I didn't think there was going to be enemies outside of Zelda I, ah well. It works well enough.

Very clever puzzle in the Goriya Fireball room! I only barely noticed that there was something off and this is after leaving the room thinking it was a dead end.

Alright! One Bomb'd Manhandla!

Another Choice Room in the Armos area, another Heart Container.

Ah, there's the Blue Ring! A nice way to include it without it being directly on the path, but isn't available from the Very start.

(Stumbles upon Level 7) Interesting... This is a really cool effect you have here!


(Makes it to a Digdogger) Well. I guess that's as far as I can go here.

Interesting idea to have the place where the Magical Sword was have a guy who tells you the new location of it. (In loose terms)

And I now have the Letter meaning I can get potions now, first I need to save up a fair amount again though to get the Blue Ring beforehand.


Level 4 Whoa. Blackouts? How did you even manage that without a script?

Oh, I almost missed a fairly obvious Heart Container/Potion room!

Another Heart Container/Potion Room I almost missed!

And the Blue Ring is finally mine!

And there's the bow... looks like I better start saving up more Rupees for the Arrow.

FINALLY found that key! I didn't realized that the dungeon would be shaped like that and never tried to bomb a specific area in the second room with Darknuts.

And Gleeok down! I was stuck in that dungeon for a very long time, but I left, looked around a bit, then went back and used a bit of common sense. All in all it wasn't that bad of a dungeon. The blackout effect though was a bit jarring on the eyes. You might want to show an outline of the room instead of just blackness.

I really like the sand theme of Level 5 and the conveyor belts actually seem to be doing something. The way it is arranged it is interesting as well, due to entering certain ways you have to go different paths into the same room to open new entrances, a very neat idea.

Oh hey! The... Flute? Well I can't say I was expecting that. I'm not even really sure where I would use that in here.

Ah, those blocks... hmm. While not obvious I knew that was one of the only things keeping me back. So I guess it doesn't need to be more apparent

The rock face of the far end of the Dungeon is a very nice aesthetic. (blows up a part of the rock, sees a slightly off-colored tile because of it) Eh...? Oh, it got rid of the barrier.

And after all of that I'm still missing a key, after I backtracked for the one at the start of the dungeon behind another flute barrier. And by this point I've been everywhere but the room that requires the key and the Boss rooms.

Hmm... as much as I would like to have more Bombs, I would like to have a key more...

(40 Minutes later...)

I think I'm going to leave this dungeon for now. I know where the next one is and all I'm missing from this one is a Key and the Boss Key.

(Goes to Dungeon 6, sees immediately that bombs are needed, sighs loudly since he just used all his bombs looking for a key in Dungeon 5)

Well I can't say I ever killed Aquamentus with Arrows before, basically necessary unless you wanted to manuever over to him with reversed controls.

This gimmick is not very fun at all. If it was in a few rooms, sure. That would be fine, but to have an entire dungeon like this does not lend itsellf well to playing.

I think I'm going to have to call it a day here. This dungeon quickly sapped my enthusiasm all around. I'll get back to it, but I've had enough for one day.

[justin1]

stopped at level6. couldn't wrap my brain around that opposite control gimmick. suppose i could have just changed my keyboard inputs for that level. i was enjoying the game up until then. regardless of whether it fits the contest rules or not, i think it would be a jarring experience having this quest start after the first 3 or 4. the puzzles are excellent, but the original NES quests don't really have any puzzles.

i think a Shoelace 1st quest re imagining (without the contest limitations) would be amazing, something to think about spinning this quest into if it doesn't make the 5th quest cut.

[Shoelace]

Oh wow, thanks for the thorough review Three Pendants.

I actually really want to remake the Zelda 1, but without the limitations I have actually been playing that since Hero of Dreams was done. However, I want to release the second part of my series before that.

For Level 6 by the way, it is definitely a Donkey Kong Country 3ish level. I hated that level too, but I felt it never been done and I wanted to use this 5th quest as an experiment. Each level had a gimmick and the gimmick of level 6 takes patience. But I noticed everyone speedruns it through which will get you into trouble. lol. I am glad I cut that level in half because I decided that any longer and people would burn houses. I am proud of it though as it did exactly what I wanted it to: Twist people's minds. Because in hindsight it is actually an easy level enemy wise and have a lot of ladder safe spots. :P

I am very happy about level 7. It seems Level 7 is my lucky number in terms of unique gimmicks. Hero of Dreams with the Season Isle and this one with the maze. I am glad people like it, even though it is difficult.

[Coyotek4]

Through 7 levels so far. I gotta say, I am LOVING the puzzles in this quest! Hard enough to make you think, but all 'fair game'. I compare this to the last quest I completed (also heavy on puzzles); in that one, I felt there was a bit too much obscurity. This one hits the sweet spot.

What this quest has in puzzles, it lacks (somewhat) in difficulty. Haven't lost a life yet, or really been close to doing so. Perhaps the difficulty ratchets up with Levels 8 and 9.

Authenticity takes a hit with the color schemes, but you're certainly not the only one taking 'creative liberties' in that regard.

Probably too easy to get all the Overworld HCs. For one in particular that needs a bomb: it'd be better to make that one require a boulder push, since you wouldn't be able to get it so quickly.

The one 'letter' hint is really unnecessary, as there's another guy who basically tells you where to go, and you can't miss that guy.

I actually got used to the control issues with Level 6 fairly easily. What was really jarring was leaving that dungeon, and trying to revert to 'normal' mode! It took a bit to readjust.

Will finish soon, hopefully. Incredible (if perhaps too easy) so far.


1ST UPDATE: started Level 8; I might've spoken too soon about how easy this is. Still have to figure out how to cross that disappearing pathway in time, as it doesn't seem to reappear after waiting. Also missing two items (not including the red ring or silver arrows, which I assume are in Level 9, or the blue candle) and a bomb upgrade. This is easily the largest level yet, so I wouldn't be shocked to get a ton of swag.

2ND UPDATE: so much for flawlessness. Lost three lives going through the gauntlet of lava puzzles in Level 8 (though I only saved the game after one of them). Got the 2nd bomb upgrade and book, but after taking a sojourn looking for Level 9, I'm convinced there's a new object in this quest that I haven't gotten yet.

3RD UPDATE: I did figure out the puzzle that I was stuck on in the 1st update. I shudder to think what the right side is like.

[Shoelace]

Hey Coyotek4!

Thanks for playing the game, I am glad you are liking the quest. I did indeed make the hearts easy to find in the overworld because I think I was just bummed that the overworld had to be the same-ish and not a lot of people were going to be passionate about searching for them.

But yes, the gimmick in Level 8 is definitely kinda has a NES/BattleToads kind of feel to it. So, you may die in order to find out how to progress. Good luck on the right side! :)

[Coyotek4]

OK, little help?

In Level 9 (though I can't help but think I missed something in Level 8). The 'left eye' room, I'm sure there's something there, but nothing I tried works. I'm guessing the red ring is in there.

Then there's the section that reminds of Level 7. Can't figure out how to get to the Level 8 part (where, I assume, I will find the silver arrows).


EDIT: figured out the 'left eye' room. Now to figure out the other part.

[Shoelace]

Sorry, it has been a long work week. First day off. lol

Anyways, I don't think you missed anything in Level 8. In Level 9, the Level 7 section, I believe you have to go down from the first screen to head to the Level 8 portion. I can't remember exactly, but I think it is that simple. I am not at my computer yet, so I hope that helps. Once I get to my computer I will confirm.

[Coyotek4]

Yeah, that did it. I'm sure you used the same trick in Level 7 and I forgot about it. Anyway, done now.

Like CJC, this quest is perhaps a bit too far off from the original quest to qualify for '5th quest' status. At the same time, I could see this quest as it's own '1st quest' series. Very imaginative, how you themed all the dungeons (later combining aspects in some of the rooms). And though I may be in the minority regarding this, I like the 'poison' control-switch gimmick. (Some of the 'lava' level, though, was ridiculously insane, though not unfair. At the least, I doubt anyone is 'zeroing' the quest on the first try.)

A couple typos here and there. Some texts were off-center (like "You're boiling") or had spacing issues (like one mentioning "two dodongo statue").

Overall, I enjoyed this quest very much. It's on my top 5 right now, but the lack of authenticity keeps it from the top spots. Still, I wouldn't mind playing a sequel to this one. I notice that you left out some aspects from earlier quests (like red/blue bubbles and 'life or money' rooms). There's a lot to work with here.

[Zweldron]

My final quest from the contest! let me say ahead of time that the main reason why this quest is going to end up with a relatively low score is because of it missing a lot of what makes a proper 5th quest- but more on that at the end.

I liked how each dungeon had a completely different feel to it. Lots of gimmicks to learn and develop. For the most part, you are eased into the concepts slowly enough to learn them, but quickly enough that you don't feel hand-held. I thought that "level 2?" was a very cute idea. The way I explore, I found it before actually clearing dungeon 1, so I was very curious as to why the question-mark. Of course, I didn't explore it until finishing dungeon 1, so by then it made sense. Very clever.Dungeon 4's lighting effects became annoying fairly quickly. I would suggest not having the blinking in more than 1 or two rooms. Having the darkness return, however, is perfectly fine.
Limited use of annoying concepts is really the key to what could have improved several dungeons. Case in point: dungeon 6. The reverse controls is cute, but does become more of an annoyance than anything else well before the level is finished. My suggestion, to keep with the "poison lake" theme, would be to have an "antidote" item (perhaps as a dungeon treasure in level 6) that would negate the reverse-controls. Perhaps even make it a location in the dungeon that has effects that you are told don't last long (and so when you hit the reverse area in dungeon 9, there is an explanation- the antidote's effects wore off).
Similarly, the pathfinding in level 7 was very tough. This is the only time during the contest maps that I needed to draw a map outside of my standard mapping sheets (I have a nice 1-page document with spaces for the overworld, all 9 dungeons, and note space; this sufficed for all 16 of the other contest maps, and except for dungeon 7 here, was fine for this one). Having a few paths "mis-connected" like this is fine, but you went overboard here.
Dungeon 8 had unintended problems (which recurred in dungeon 9). Due to the unpredictability of certain bosses (lanmolas, patras are the main culprits), I had several melting rooms where the boss hung out along the edge, and so I had no chance to defeat it. Forced deaths, especially after going through 5 to 8 time-sensitive rooms in a row really ruins things. I would say that since there are plenty of extra rooms on this map, checkpoints would have been nice- Put a key-door in several rooms to a blank one, and provide the key in the previous room. Use that door as a 2-way path to the entrance area. Only 1 or 2 such changes on each half would have made this a lot less frustrating.
Aside from the annoyances, however, the map was generally very easy, which is why it really doesn't fit as a 5th quest (as you, yourself, implied earlier in this thread) Also, all the twists and gimmicks really caused it to lose the feel of the earlier quests. Now, I like puzzles, and so I really enjoyed most of the quest. Unfortunately, I have to rate it based on the purpose of the contest.
Highs and lows combined, I give this map a 3.28 out of 5. If this were NOT a contest map, it would have earned almost a full point more- the problems mentioned above being the only things I can mark it down for- and as I said, much of that was overuse of the gimmicks, not flaws in the map.