ZC Hater

[Brasel]

www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/

Yeah, I came across this today. I thought it was kind of interesting to read. He's just jealous he didn't think of it.

[The_Amaster]

*laughs* Wow, that was a good read.

[AlphaDawg]

The first time I clicked this link I got a "server timed out" error. I was ready to close the tab and move on, but I figured I'd click "refresh" just this once. The page loaded. Boy, am I glad I refreshed! This page is nothing but a diatribe against my very own Official Third Quest! Awesome!

For the record, the author's wrong on so many levels, but I won't waste time debunking him.

I wonder who wrote this. I'm suspecting Glenn the Sore Loser Great whatever his latest ban-evading handle is...

[bigjoe]

http://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/zelda101.png

LMAO. I'll have to admit, that was funny.

[Brasel]

The first time I clicked this link I got a "server timed out" error. I was ready to close the tab and move on, but I figured I'd click "refresh" just this once. The page loaded. Boy, am I glad I refreshed! This page is nothing but a diatribe against my very own Official Third Quest! Awesome!

For the record, the author's wrong on so many levels, but I won't waste time debunking him.

I wonder who wrote this. I'm suspecting Glenn the Sore Loser Great whatever his latest ban-evading handle is...

Trust me, I know he's wrong, I just thought YOU in particular would be interested in this. ;) And I think if I remember correctly, it was Nightmare being the sore loser about losing that contest.

[Shazza Dani]

http://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gif http://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gifhttp://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gif http://www.bimshwel.com/pwah/zoda/eldmin.gif

I never knew the old man sprite was messed up in ZC... D:

[Joe123]

Heh, that was quite amusing ^_^

Not that I've played the third quest though.

[Aegix Drakan]

Meh.

If I want to see ranting that's genuinely funny, I'll watch zero punctuation. At least I can view his stuff as satirical, more than anything.

[Russ]

Wow, what a loser. He's just jealous that he can't play/make quests very well.

[The_Amaster]

If I want to see ranting that's genuinely funny, I'll watch zero punctuation. At least I can view his stuff as satirical, more than anything.

Funnily enough, I mentally heard

In summation: I like the idea of Zelda Classic, and it's certainly a lot better than I'd expect from something which opens with this screen, but I really hate its attitude and that stupid third quest. in Yahtzee's voice. The first half (up to "screen") sounds exactly like something he'd say.

[AlphaDawg]

Trust me, I know he's wrong, I just thought YOU in particular would be interested in this. ;) And I think if I remember correctly, it was Nightmare being the sore loser about losing that contest.Nightmare was one of the judges. Glenn was definitely the sore loser. Unfortunately all of the relevant threads are long since pruned. That's too bad, because they would have made quite an entertaining read.

I know Nightmare in real life... if he has issues with any of my quests he lets me know directly. So this was definitely NOT authored by him.

It's hard to put into words just how special I feel now. Somebody has taken quite a bit of their precious time to rake one of my masterpieces over the coals!

I tried tracking down the author of the piece, to no avail so far.

[Jackal]

This guy is so full of himself and desperate to make others worship him, he finds the best things out there and tries to trash them to make himself look good. He'll have an ulcer by the time he's thirty.:)

[lucas92]

Also, he looks like a doom gamer.... He was always making allusions to its editor.

[Shazza Dani]

Also, he looks like a doom gamer.... He was always making allusions to its editor.

Yeah, I thought it was weird that he kept talking about Doom. Like, what the heck does that have to do with Zelda Classic?

[Yirzod]

Good day, kind sirs. Against anything resembling better (or even just good) judgment I have decided to briefly appear here and address your concerns. Since Mr. Dawg claims to have attempted to track me up, I thought my additional input was in some way desired. Do feel free to correct me on that.
Yes, so, the whole site is mine. As such I generally don't provide personal identifying information on individual pages. Few people care, besides. Or so I thought!

My famous web site has never been the most navigable, so it's possible to look at the main page and see no reference to a notorious article such as that of issue here. For those of who didn't quite "get" it, in summary I simply thought the third quest was needlessly difficult in a superficial way. The esteemed artist's peers seem to disagree with me, so that is surely a good thing. Indeed, I would not expect users of this associated forum to have anything but doubt and contempt for something like what I wrote. And so all is as it should be.

I admit, my complaining may have been excessive, perhaps even a tad whiny, and I've only just now realized the quest in quest-ion (oh ho ho!) is over seven years old, and surely forgivable a few of its annoying aspects. By contrast, my annoying page that is mostly about it has only been online for a little over seven months.

As for the program itself, I am not a "zc hater." Aside from its Nesticle-esque color palette, it admirably imitates the original game's programming and has done a marvelous job of not getting sued out of existence or at least turned into GRAAL Classic over its blatant copyright violations. I appreciate the 3 color NES elements. It has been my experience that when people have to make custom graphics for this sort of thing they just plain do it wrong.

Doom is pretty neat. I thought as long as I was talking about outdated computer games a few dedicated internet wackos maintain continued interest in, it was worth comparing a single aspect of their editing systems.

I hope this has helped.

[Brasel]

Nightmare was one of the judges. Glenn was definitely the sore loser. Unfortunately all of the relevant threads are long since pruned. That's too bad, because they would have made quite an entertaining read.

I know Nightmare in real life... if he has issues with any of my quests he lets me know directly. So this was definitely NOT authored by him.

It's hard to put into words just how special I feel now. Somebody has taken quite a bit of their precious time to rake one of my masterpieces over the coals!

I tried tracking down the author of the piece, to no avail so far.

Ah, my bad. I just remember someone talking to me through IM about how pissed they were it wasn't their quest that won. I remember I did used to talk to Nightmare on occasion on IM, and I guess I mixed up some memories or soemthing. Nightmare, if you read this, sorry about the mistaken identity :P

[SUCCESSOR]

I personally found it to be a great read. I've never played 3rd quest but hey, Alpha, any publicity is good publicity. I'd be a little bitter too if I couldn't find the second sword in a deliberately hard quest.

He also made some good points. Like how awful and outdated the Armageddon Games logo screen is. Really are you gonna take something seriously from a guy who puts that much time into writing about nothing?

[Yirzod]

Oh, please don't take me seriously.

Yes, hello again. I say "again" as my initial post in here a day or two ago was rudely abducted by your automatic moderation system and never seen again. How that sort of thing encourages intelligent conversation I have no idea.

I like a challenge. I don't like a tease. Legend of Zelda is a game of few clues but with basic monster programming, simplistic level designs, and most importantly, reasonable access to necessary game completion tools balancing that out. Essentially, it was made in 1985. Hiding the second sword, a fairly essential item, as if it's a bonus trinket is not "difficulty," it's annoying, especially if the amount of nasty monsters has increased. If I have to go to the author's personal, beframed website to find it, that's hardly in the spirit of the original game, is it? It should be noted that Dawg himself here has admitted to not being able to find my own website, despite the linked page being on it.

[MasterSwordUltima]

So basically, you made a rant on your personal blog about how you don't like how a group of fans of Zelda voted a challenging fan made quest to represent them?

Because thats all I got out of it. That and you like to draw imps, along with taking pictures inside of your grocery store.

[AlphaDawg]

Oh, please don't take me seriously.

Yes, hello again. I say "again" as my initial post in here a day or two ago was rudely abducted by your automatic moderation system and never seen again. How that sort of thing encourages intelligent conversation I have no idea.

I like a challenge. I don't like a tease. Legend of Zelda is a game of few clues but with basic monster programming, simplistic level designs, and most importantly, reasonable access to necessary game completion tools balancing that out. Essentially, it was made in 1985. Hiding the second sword, a fairly essential item, as if it's a bonus trinket is not "difficulty," it's annoying, especially if the amount of nasty monsters has increased. If I have to go to the author's personal, beframed website to find it, that's hardly in the spirit of the original game, is it? It should be noted that Dawg himself here has admitted to not being able to find my own website, despite the linked page being on it.Howdy! Thanks for joining us here! Please stay a while, the ZC forums could use some nice, vibrant, respectful discussion.

There were no navigation buttons that I could see on the page Anthony linked to. So all I could do was manually browse back a few folders. I couldn't find a link to the article this way. If the link is in plain sight on one of your main pages then I apologize. Also if your contact info is in plain sight somewhere I apologize.

I actually like your website by the way. You have several very amusing articles on it. Never in this thread did I trash any of your work. I said you were wrong on a lot of points (I'll address that later) and I jokingly speculated one of the non-winners who's been a troublemaker here for years might have been responsible for the review.

Please understand I'm not upset about your review of my quest. I'm a grown man, 28 years old. I can take some criticism. I actually agree with you on some points. I recently returned to AGN after a four-year hiatus and played through my third quest. Parts of it were pissing me off too! Hell, it's been what, four or five years since I made that quest, I've learned much about quest design since then.

That said, it wasn't a total freelance job. There were several requirements each submission had to meet. I don't remember them off the top of my head, and as I mentioned before threads detailing them here have long since been pruned. I think they would adequately address many of your points of contention, such as the White Sword being hidden so devilishly. (It's where Level 2 was in the First Quest, by the way.)

The cheat code "ALPHA" to access the third quest wasn't my idea by the way. I have never had anything to do with the coding of ZC, so I couldn't possibly have put it in myself. I do think it's a nice touch, and a nod to the original's "ZELDA" cheat.

What I honestly think we have here is a generation gap thing. I'm going to go out on a limb and assume you are much younger than me. My formative years were spent playing games such as The Legend of Zelda on the NES. The last FPS game I was any good at was Duke 3D. I've never played any next-gen (N64 or later) Zelda game. "Old-school" 2D gaming where in-game information is sparse is where it's at for me. It may not be that way for you, and that's OK.

I was hungering for more Zelda 1-style action since the first time I completed the original second quest, which was probably way back in 1988 or 1989. When I found out about Zelda Classic I was thrilled! I was on ZQuest like white on rice the day it released. It is no coincidence that the day it released and my registration date here (7/16/2000) are exactly the same.

As for having to go to my website for help... let's remind ourselves that we are dealing with a fan project here, not a wildly-popular console game. There's my website, these forums, other various ZC boards, and that's about it. Really, I think it's all one can expect.

Here's a little inside baseball... my original submission for this contest was criticized by The Silent Assassin, also one of the judges, as being too easy! Originally the later levels did not have as many shooting statues as they do now. Also, though I don't know if you made it that far, the secret rooms in Level 9 ("Murderer's Row" as I liked to refer to it in testing) did not exist. Those were his suggestions to toughen the quest up.

OK, that's all I got for now.

[Yirzod]

The other post I made was less eh aggressive, though rather long. I became peeved when it disappeared before it went anywhere. In general I don't do well with forums (evidenced by the "yimpinkilp" picture used on the page). I've already embarrassed myself in this vicinity twice so I hope to leave it at that.

So basically, you made a rant on your personal blog about how you don't like how a group of fans of Zelda voted a challenging fan made quest to represent them?

Because thats all I got out of it. That and you like to draw imps, along with taking pictures inside of your grocery store.
What else could you hope to get out of it? Indeed, it is not for everyone. It isn't even for most people. Sometimes it is not for any people. And so, aside from readers of this forum topic, very few people have seen the problem item. Additionally, I believed the presence of such support for the quest indicated that it could handle a bit of dissent. And apparently it could. There's no point to complaining about something everybody says they hate, is there?


As for having to go to my website for help... let's remind ourselves that we are dealing with a fan project here, not a wildly-popular console game. There's my website, these forums, other various ZC boards, and that's about it. Really, I think it's all one can expect.
I don't argue about what website it was, just that I would have to ask for help at all. I remember calling the Nintendo Power hotline about a hidden entrance to a mandatory dungeon in 1991's Final Fantasy Adventure and thinking it was rather a big deal. I still like that better than its Sword of Mana remake, however.

Obviously, it is easy to find amateur internet offerings to pick nits off of. But I don't. That's rude. This seemed, so labelled as "official" (obviously it wasn't but for the purposes of the user-made imitation game it was) and supplied with the program to be more than a simple, abusable fan creation, and so worth complaining at to no one in particular. In my mind, at the time, it was no different than some of the early shareware I wrote about back in the better days of bimshwel. Perhaps this is not the case!

That was never supposed to be on a special page; it had simply grown to the point that the installed wordpress had ceased to be willing to process it. In its intended context of other whininess I think it is slightly more forgivable.

It occurs to me now, the very idea that there SHOULD be a "third quest," utilizing the exact same over-world and level lay-outing paradigm, with only alternate entrances and extra harassment to keep it interesting is misguided. There was probably no way I was going to like whatever won. That this development should happen through an individualistic, non-cooperative contest judged by silent assassins doesn't strike me as entirely sensible, either, but I wasn't around to see that so I can't say for certain.


The last FPS game I was any good at was Duke 3D
I wasn't even good at that. Hexen appears to have been my limit.