You crazy Commu....er, I mean Russians.

[Trevelyan_06]

First you test a new type of gigantic bomb (http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/09/12/russia.bomb.ap/index.html), and then you dissolve your government (http://www.cnn.com/2007/WORLD/europe/09/12/russia.parliament.ap/index.html)! You're just full of fun fun silly willy thing aren't you?

I can't really get a feel for WTF is going on here, but when it comes to Russia and instability I think there is legitimate reason to be concerned. What's really disconcerting is the fact that apparently Russia is no longer buddy buddy with us. I mean, I can understand why most countries don't like the USA right now, but we really DO NOT want to start getting into a pissing contest with Russia right now. They maybe only a shell of their former selfs, but you gotta realize, that's the shell of a former super power that is still armed with strategic nuclear arms.

I really hope that our illustrious leader isn't too stupid to realize that it's not a good idea to fuck around too much with Russia for no good reason. You know, kinda like he's been doing with pretty much all the other countries in the world.

[rock_nog]

Dear God, Putin's all kinds of crazy. Didn't he get the memo? The Cold War's over.

[{DSG}DarkRaven]

Drat, you beat me to posting this exact thread under the title "Cold War II: The Coldening". By seven minutes.

Russia hasn't exactly been buddy buddy with us for many years, and I'd even go so far as to say that it's an exaggeration to say that they ever were. Certainly things got better for a while, but there hasn't ever been much love between the US and the Russians.

I don't ascribe to the "Bush has teh dumb, omg ww3 we r doomed!" platform you seem to be suggesting, Trev, but that's mostly because in this day and age, that sort of large scale conquest is strategically impossible. It wouldn't do Russia any good, under anyone, to conquer the US, and vice versa. The cost is impossibly unjustified, and that alone will stave off any war between the two of us for the forseeable future. Short of an accident, nobody is really stupid enough to engage either country in a full-scale war, conventionally or radiologically. Frankly (and sadly), terrorism is the only method that makes much sense anymore.

Only time will tell how this will end, but I think it will end sooner rather than later. Putin will screw things up, but not everyone will stand for it for long.

[phattonez]

Yes, Russia is still close to its totalitarian history. Why anyone would allow this or think it is a good idea is beyond me, but then again, I'm not Russian.

[Lilith]

I'd totally bang Putin, fyi.

[Aegix Drakan]

I'm confused...

This statement:

Unlike a nuclear weapon, the bomb doesn't hurt the environment, he added.
directly contradicts THIS statement:

It explodes in a terrifying nuclear bomb-like mushroom cloud and wreaks destruction through a massive shock wave created by the air burst and high temperature.


>_> I don't think that discovering new ways to kill more people at once is any cause for celebration... Plus, combined with the dissolution of the Russian government... It seems just a weee bit dangerous, no?

Oy... it's the cold war all over again... *goes to prepare anti-bomb Igloo*

[MottZilla]

It's not surprising really. But war was more or less made obsolete when weapons so far exceeded defenses. It's just a cock waving manuver really. They just want people to know Russia has a giant cock. It's somewhat similar to our own way of assuring everyone the US has a big cock, where we go invade countrys (because or retarded leaders) and drop bombs and such. The actual news is spotty anyway. They don't really give any details, furthermore just because your bomb is on the scale of a nuclear weapon doesn't mean it's any more acceptable than using a nuclear weapon. I think everyone in the world would find it unacceptable for someone to use such a large scale weapon.

[Trevelyan_06]

Russia hasn't exactly been buddy buddy with us for many years, and I'd even go so far as to say that it's an exaggeration to say that they ever were. Certainly things got better for a while, but there hasn't ever been much love between the US and the Russians.

I don't ascribe to the "Bush has teh dumb, omg ww3 we r doomed!" platform you seem to be suggesting, Trev, but that's mostly because in this day and age, that sort of large scale conquest is strategically impossible. It wouldn't do Russia any good, under anyone, to conquer the US, and vice versa. The cost is impossibly unjustified, and that alone will stave off any war between the two of us for the forseeable future. Short of an accident, nobody is really stupid enough to engage either country in a full-scale war, conventionally or radiologically. Frankly (and sadly), terrorism is the only method that makes much sense anymore.


Yeah I really meant to put little " " things around buddy but I forgot. You're right we weren't ever that close of allies, but for awhile there we both were at pains to be all "OMG we're so best buddies" in a strained, awkward sort of way. It wasn't really a, "Hey, lets have a sleep-over! Alright!" kind of alliance , but we when compared to how we treated each other during the cold war, it was like we were dating or something.

I also didn't mean that Bush was going to cause the end of the world or anything. It's just that if he gets all pissy with Russia like he does with some of the other countries of the world, things will be not good. The Russians were the ones that originally provided large amounts of weapons to various piss-ant third world countries so they'd fight the US for them. It'd be easy for them to start during that again.

What I meant about the nuclear weapon thing is a warning not so much that'd we used them on each other but that we'd start pointing them at each other again. That caused lots of strain on the military and your average citizens during the Cold War. I don't think that Russia has enough money to start another arms race, but you never know where these countries might get money. A second round of the arms race would probably focus on weapons like the super bomb that Russia developed. Weapons that did massive amount of destruction but are not chemical, biological, or nuclear in nature.

[{DSG}DarkRaven]

Mott has it pretty well nailed down, I think. With offense almost hillariously outweighing offense these days, short of an obviously funded terrorist program against the USA, there's no way we'd go to war with Russia. So what if they've got their weapons pointed at us? Is that some kind of threat? Certainly, in some form. But in another way, it's sort of like they're shaking their fist at us. In response, we shake our fist at them in return. So... great. Both fists are shaking. Now what? Do we shake harder? "Oh yeah, Russia? Well now our nukes are even MORE pointed at you. What're you gonna do about that, huh?"

I'm not that worried, clearly, but I certainly understand that some people are.

[Freedom]

Congressmen briefed on fallout-shelter plan
http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=57570

[Skulkraken]

Those Russians have really been trying to stir up trouble lately. About a month or two ago, they sent a pair of bombers (http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2007/08/10/america/NA-GEN-US-Russia-War-Games.php) out here to Guam to try to get the attention of all the American troops taking part in the Valiant Shield exercises. From what I understand, they've also been having their bombers buzz by other nations as well.

[Trevelyan_06]

Is that some kind of threat? Certainly, in some form. But in another way, it's sort of like they're shaking their fist at us. In response, we shake our fist at them in return.

That's the problem though. It might just be fist shaking but it makes it a lot worse if someone fucks up and the missiles are already pointed at each other. The other thing to take into consideration is the fact that such fist shaking cost lots and lots of money. That's part of the reason why the US won the cold war, we had a bigger wallet than the Soviets did. If they're scrapping to get enough men for the army now, just imagine what it would be like if we started another arms race with Russia. They thought about the draft for Iraq, if something got started with Russia, there would be one.

[Aegix Drakan]

Drafts... ugh...I hate that whole concept

Seriously, If the government came up to me and said "You go to war." I'd say "You go screw yourself". I am a pacifist, and If I was ever on a battlefield, I'd be a massive liability. I just cannot designate another human being as a target. Oh, that's even if I managed to survive the training. I'd rather go to jail then go to war. At least in jail, I know there's about 5 people out to hurt me, instead of one thousand people out to kill me.

Something I find stupid about the whole situation is that not many people seem to understand that "the enemy" is human too. Each soldier on the other side has hopes, dreams, a loved one, a life. I'm NOT blaming the soldiers for killing the "enemy" (after all, it's their job, and they just follow orders *nods respectfully to Anthony*), I'm blaming the idiots who decide "hey, let's go invade X country for Y reasons" and then simply think of the deaths on the field as simple figures on paper.

I'm sorry, but the only way I'd EVER fight a war is if the other side has sworn to murder every man, woman and child, and is knocking on my front door. Then it's self-defense, and I can sorta live with that.

[Trevelyan_06]

Drafts... ugh...I hate that whole concept

I am a pacifist, and If I was ever on a battlefield, I'd be a massive liability.

You'd be considered a consensuses objector. You'd be placed doing something in the army that has nothing to do with an actual battlefield. You would be a mail clerk or something here in the states. The army thought of things like that when it revamped the draft system for Vietnam.

It would take a lot of bad things happening at exactly the right (or rather wrong) time for something like a new cold war and a draft to happen. However, having said that, I can see Bush starting us down the path that could eventually lead us there. The man has no sense of tact to him at all. When you look at the Presidents that dealt with the Soviet Union during the height of the cold war, and then compare them to Bush you'll see what I'm talking about. The cold war was a giant game of covert move and covert counter-move, skirmish disguised as "police actions" and political maneuvers on many levels. It was a giant balancing act between two super powers and the fate of the world was resting on the shoulders of leaders on both sides who understood that subtly was needed to keep the world from blowing itself apart. On the other hand, Bush's policy when it comes to wars and such has been, "1. Find meat grinder. 2. Insert dick 3. Repeatedly turn crank."

[The_Amaster]

I am dead serious when I say that if it comes to a draft, I'm moving to Canada. It's like, a hundred miles away.

Actually, if Russia attacked us now, we'd be in trouble. All of our forces are spread out over the middle east. Butter over too much bread.

[phattonez]

^^At least we'd have them in the right continent.

A war with Russia, if it happened, would have to be a global conflict. There would be an agressor, preferrably them, and then the one who is attacked would ideally get helped from around the world. I would hope that the UN would work like that and require that nations help us.

But yeah, in a war like that, no one would win.

[Starkist]

http://www.theonion.com/content/infograph/russia_engages_in_saber