Why songs fade instead of the ending(outro)

[cbailey78]

I have a very interesting question that has been pondering me alot so here goes: Why do songs on cd's and songs on the radio fade out like 80-90% of the music instead of FINISHING the music to the ending especially a song that sounds so good. I would love to see what the rest of the song is like bypassing the fadeout continuing until the ending. That would be like exploring unseen areas in Nintendo games!

Here is an example of songs:

Songs that fades out"
It must have been love by Roxette
All by myself by Celine Dion
I'm the only one by Melissa Ethridge

Songs that have ending
All coming back to me by Celine Dion
Can't fight this feeling by REO Speedwagon
Come to my window by melissa ethridge

[symbiote]

I have a very interesting question that has been pondering me alot so here goes: Why do songs on cd's and songs on the radio fade out like 80-90% of the music instead of FINISHING the music to the ending especially a song that sounds so good.

I think it's psychological- an 'ending' is an excuse to turn the radio off, or otherwise be satisfied with what you've got. By fading it out, it leaves you wanting more (which the radio station is happy to provide!).
It also might be a time thing for radio- an average outro takes an extra 10-30 seconds that could be spent dropping in an ad to help pay for the station. Time = Money, after all.

[Dark Nation]

Sometimes, the song writers can't think of a good ending for a song, so they just keep repeating the chorus or refrain and fade that out.

[erm2003]

My friends and I sometimes call it the 80s fade out because it seems like almost every song from the 80s did that. I agree with DN. In most cases they were like that because they didn't have a great ending so they did the fade. However symbiote make an important point. I have heard many songs on the radio that are faded out in the end but are not on the actual CD. It's always a money thing. Have you also ever realized that sometimes radio will drop intros to some songs too if they are purely instrumental? It's all about the money.

[elise]

The " 80s'" fade out was in The Netherlands on the radio cause through the 70s and 80s we where sitting infront the radio with the tape deck to get the numbers from the radio , they also always talked through it so if we wanted the whole number we had to buy it.
The second reason that numbers have it is indeed the not knowing how to end a number.

[Dechipher]

Some songs need a faded ending. For Instance, Metallica's "Fade to Black". On the CD it fades, live they obviously don't. The live version just sounds awkward.

Fades should happen on a repeated part, like a chorus or a repeated phrase. Especially if there's a really catchy hook or good message the artist wants to get into the listeners head, and they repeat that over and over so it's the last thing you hear and so you know it's important. Not every song can just suddenly end without sounding incredibly out of place. Fades are usually the producer/mixing/mastering guy's job. The band has input, but they rarely write songs and say "Let's totally fade this." Once they get the album track order figured out, there needs to be a flow to the album as a whole, as well as in between tracks. Thus some tracks need to fade, to keep the tension<>release of the album in due order.
That's my take on it, anyway.

[Darth Marsden]

Fades happen because songwriters can't be arsed to end the song properly. In my book, if a song fades out, it looses many, many points. Grr.

[Dechipher]

Fades happen because songwriters can't be arsed to end the song properly. In my book, if a song fades out, it looses many, many points. Grr.

What's the difference between a pop song fading out and a Orchestral movement thinning out into nothing?

Mahler's Adagietto (movement four) from his fifth symphony does that, but does that lessen the piece for you? There is this long chord held out and slowly the instruments fade into nothing, in the orchestral equivalent to a radio song fading out.

Very rarely is the fade of a song due to laziness or lack of creativity. There are only so many ways to end a song without lessening the overall piece or sounding really out of place. Fading is just another method.

This project I worked on over the summer incorporated fades throughout. On one piece it faded out, and then there was rain noises for 45 seconds, followed by a fade in of a new section half a step higher, which went on for a few minutes and subsequently faded out. We planned the fades in before we recorded the material.

Sometimes ending a piece with a final chord or letting it ring just doesn't do it. Fades are just another way to make the song complete.

[Darth Marsden]

Are you really comparing songs like Ride of the Valkyries to ones like Pon de Replay?

Shakes head and walks away

[AtmaWeapon]

Are you really comparing songs like Ride of the Valkyries to ones like Pon de Replay?

Shakes head and walks awayYes, I believe he is and the comparison is valid. Just because a piece is "classical" or "of great worth" doesn't mean you can't use it in comparison to another work of art.

Can I not compare Toulouse-Lautrec's usage of ghastly figures to personify Absinthe to Hirst's usage of dead animals as a means to make an impact on the viewer via fear? (At the Moulin Rouge (http://www.artic.edu/artaccess/AA_Impressionist/pages/IMP_11_lg.shtml) vs. The Physical Impossibility of Death in the Mind of Someone Living (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Hirst-Shark.jpg))? Raphael's The School of Athens (http://britton.disted.camosun.bc.ca/goldslide/school_athens.jpg) is a significant example of the development of linear perspective. Duchamp's Nude Descending a Staircase (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Duchamp_-_Nude_Descending_a_Staircase.jpg) is one of the earliest Cubist works. Is Duchamp's work towards perspective in art less significant because he came later?

Anyway, I find the orchestra example posted earlier quite interesting because it presents the fadeout as a musical technique; only through modern technology do we accomplish a fadeout by reducing the volume. In fact, given time to dig through my library I am sure I have at least two songs that both fade in one instrument at a time and fade out one instrument at a time, producing a very interesting effect.

My personal belief is the only person qualified to decide whether a song deserves a fadeout or a "proper" ending is the artist that creates it. Often, a song that fades tends to have a chorus or melody that is particularly important to the work as a whole, and the fade serves to emphasize this element. Suggestion that the effect is used to avoid the creation of an ending to a song is pretty ridiculous, since the song will one day have to be played live and an ending must be created for it. Honestly I can't think of a song with a fadeout ending that isn't appropriate at the moment; perhaps if you limit your taste in music to that which you like you get less upset at the artist's choice?

Also a good reason for the radio fadeout is to shorten songs; When I did listen to the radio I was often surprised to find that many songs on a CD contained longer endings, repeated choruses, etc. that I had never heard on the radio. Airtime is money.