It may be over

[phattonez]

Castro seems likely to die soon and the U.S. is ready to invest in a transition to a Democratic government.

Story here (http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060801/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_cuba_10;_ylt=AnaFHZtQa0.8HTZLFYuZ_gNhxXsA;_ylu= X3oDMTBiMW04NW9mBHNlYwMlJVRPUCUl)


WASHINGTON - With Cuban President Fidel Castro (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=Fidel+Castro) ailing, the State Department raised the possibility Tuesday of a democratic transition on the island and said the United States is prepared to support such a step.
Castro, who underwent surgery for an intestinal problem, surrendered power temporarily to his brother, Raul, No. 2 in the chain of command.
Spokesman Sean McCormack said the United States has no doubt that the Cuban people are weary of communist rule after 47 years and are eager to choose their leaders rather than having them imposed on the country.
"We believe that the Cuban people aspire and thirst for democracy and that given the choice they would choose a democratic government," he said.
The White House said it is monitoring the health crisis of the Cuban leader.
"In the event that Cuba does start to make a transition to a democracy, the United States and the American people will do everything that we can to stand by the Cuban people in their aspirations for democracy," McCormack said.
Three weeks before the official announcement in Havana of Castro's deteriorating health, a U.S. presidential commission called for an $80 million program to bolster non-governmental groups in Cuba for the purpose of hastening an end to the country's communist system.
The report also proposed "assistance in preparing the Cuban military forces to adjust to an appropriate role in a democracy." It provided no details on this point.
Cuba's National Information Agency called the report a "new plan of aggression" that violated the island's national sovereignty.
"We can't speculate on Castro's health, but we continue to work for the day of Cuba's freedom," White House spokesman Peter Watkins said Tuesday. .
The official announcement in Havana said Castro, who will be 80 in two weeks, underwent intestinal surgery.
On Monday, before Castro's illness was announced, President Bush (http://search.news.yahoo.com/search/news/?p=President+Bush) was in Miami and spoke of the island's future.
"If Fidel Castro were to move on because of natural causes, we've got a plan in place to help the people of Cuba understand there's a better way than the system in which they've been living under," he told WAQI-AM Radio Mambi, a Spanish-language radio station. "No one knows when Fidel Castro will move on. In my judgment, that's the work of the Almighty."
At the time the 95-page commission report was released, Bush said, "We are actively working for change in Cuba, not simply waiting for change."
The United States and Cuba have been unbending adversaries since Castro entered into an alliance with the Soviet Union and converted his country into a Marxist-Leninist state in the early 1960s.
Hostilities reached a peak during that period, marked by the failed Bay of Pigs invasion and the Cuban missile crisis.
There have been no high-level political contacts between the two countries since 1982. The collapse of European communism almost two decades ago was a severe blow to Castro, both politically and economically.
Lately, his fortunes have improved somewhat with the emergence of left-of-center and leftist government in Latin America, most notably in Venezuela, where President Hugo Chavez has used his oil wealth to back policies long espoused by Castro.
For years, successive administrations have tailored their Cuba policies with an eye toward winning support from the vote-rich Cuban-American community in South Florida, which is predominantly anti-Castro. The U.S. trade embargo has been the centerpiece of American policy toward Cuba for more than 40 years.
Rep. Ileana Ros-Lehtinen (news (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/DailyNews/politics/news/ap/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_cuba/19838065/*http://news.search.yahoo.com/search/news?fr=news-storylinks&p=%22Rep.%20Ileana%20Ros%20Lehtinen%22&c=&n=20&yn=c&c=news&cs=nw), bio (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/capadv/bio/ap/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_cuba/19838065/SIG=11778meoq/*http://yahoo.capwiz.com/y/bio/?id=180), voting record (http://us.rd.yahoo.com/dailynews/capadv/vote/ap/ap_on_go_ca_st_pe/us_cuba/19838065/SIG=11gnvesd5/*http://yahoo.capwiz.com/y/bio/keyvotes/?id=180)), R-Fla., a member of the House International Relations Committee who has long opposed Castro, said even a temporary relinquishment of power by Castro is "a great day for the Cuban people and for their brothers and sisters in exile."
"Fidel Castro has only brought ruin and misery to Cuba, so if he is incapacitated, even for a short period of time, it is a marvelous moment for the millions of Cubans who live under his iron-fisted rule and oppressive state machinery," she said. "I hope this is the beginning of the end for his despised regime."
Sen. Mel Martinez, R-Fla., who like Ros-Lehtinen was born in Cuba, joined with her in saying they expect U.S. action for now will be limited to transmitting radio messages of hope to the Cuban people and preventing an influx of illegal immigrants from the island.
Martinez said he is confident the Navy and Coast Guard have the necessary resources to prevent refugees from trying to flood U.S. borders.
He also said he would not support lifting the U.S. embargo on Cuba until reform was under way. Instead, the United States should lend its ear to political dissidents and pressure outside forces, such as Venezuela, to limit support of the communist regime, the senator said.

[Beldaran]

"Over, your rule is. And not short enough it was."

I hope he dies. I hate authoritarian governments.

[phattonez]

I can finally agree with Beldaran on something, sadly it had to be on death.

[Dechipher]

Great. Let's spread ourselves even thinner.

GO G DUB! GO G DUB!

[gdorf]

Great. Let's spread ourselves even thinner.

GO G DUB! GO G DUB!

From what I've heard, the plan is to invest 80 million over two years in promoting democracy. That sounds reasonable to me. :shrug:


On another note, I wonder if people are frantically trying to move their cuban cigars before they lose their value. :rolleyes:

[{DSG}DarkRaven]

Great. Let's spread ourselves even thinner.

GO G DUB! GO G DUB!


That's 80 million, with an M, not billion with a B. Beyond that miniscule amount of money, exactly how are we spreading anything thinner? Nowhere in that entire document does it say anything about invading cuba or supplying troops in a post-Castro peacekeeping effort. At the most, we'll probably train some troops and supply some equipment, which is nothing that we don't already do to dozens of other countries.

[Orion]

That's 80 million, with an M, not billion with a B. Beyond that miniscule amount of money, exactly how are we spreading anything thinner? Nowhere in that entire document does it say anything about invading cuba or supplying troops in a post-Castro peacekeeping effort. At the most, we'll probably train some troops and supply some equipment, which is nothing that we don't already do to dozens of other countries.

80 Mil would but several hundred people new homes in New Orleans. Apparently spreading democrazy is more important than helping our own people here?

[{DSG}DarkRaven]

There's plenty of aid already allocated to New orleans, and it's been said time and again that there are far more effective ways to rebuild the city than simply having the government do it. Millions in government aid have already been abused and improperly distributed, so do you really want another eighty million to be funnelled into some crooked contractors prostitute fund? Besides, 80 million over two years is chump change. The US could easily, very easily invest a lot more into Cuba. I'd think that everyone who's against the war would be happy to see our government peacefully aiding another country and helping it create a flourishing democracy, but it looks like I've underestimated the liberals once again. Rather than try to balance foreign and domestic issues, it seems like you'd all rather see our taxes spent on nothing outside our own borders.

FYI, there is a whole planet out there beyond the borders of the USA.

[Rainman]

Yay, we're going to spend 80 million dollars to try to turn it from Communism to Socialist Democracy. What a difference.

[phattonez]

Yay, we're going to spend 80 million dollars to try to turn it from Communism to Socialist Democracy. What a difference.

That's exactly like saying what's the difference between having no representaion vs. actual representation.

[Dechipher]

I'm just saying. When are we gonna stop policing the globe and forcing our views upon others? We do that enough in our own damn country we don't need to spread it to others.

Yeah, that 80M may not be THAT big of a deal right now. We're only like 8 trillion dollars in debt, right? It's not like we can ever just save our money.

I'm all for promoting American values in a healthy way, once we get them all sorted out and get our country's shit together.

[Aegix Drakan]

one more communist country down...

but I think the US is REALLY jumping the gun by making all these plans before castro is even dead.

I don't really like the idea of forcing our ideals on others, but...in some cases, it's the lesser evil. for example, I would not mind one bit if Iran was forced to conform to democratic, and gender-respecting laws. I get SICK every time I think of all the inoocent girls they kill off, and for no morally acceptable reason.

anyway...here's hoping that cuba is freed.

[Brasel]

Who's saying that his brother is going to relinquish control if Fidel dies? Does anyone really think that that will happen? I dunno, but I'd think that his brother being his number 2 man would probably keep things communistic.

[phattonez]

His brother doesn't have as much respect from the Cuban people. If you ever get the chance to go to Cuba, you would see billboards and posters with pictures of and quotes by Che, Jose Marti, and Fidel. There's nothing of Raul. Fidel did well to make Che and Fidel like legends (and I hated to put Jose Marti in that list because he wasn't communist; he wrote poetry about Cuba's independence and he died in the Spanish-American War). Raul is too old to start something that glorifies him, so if the US ever had a chance to step in, it's now.

And do you think it's okay to spread some of our ideals such as that blind hatred is wrong (Iran)?

[{DSG}DarkRaven]

I'm just saying. When are we gonna stop policing the globe and forcing our views upon others? We do that enough in our own damn country we don't need to spread it to others.

I agree, in part, that America doesn't need to be the global police. I'm pretty certain that's the UN's job. Unfortunately, they don't seem to have been doing a very good job of that the last few years. If the rest of the world would band together to help foster significant change in countries like Iran, Iraq, Cuba, etc., we wouldn't have to shoulder so much of the burden.

However, as the strongest country in the world, I believe we have a duty to help out countries and peoples that cannot stand for themselves. The strong always have an obligation to help the weak. And not to trash fiscal responsibility in any way, but we'd be just as hated by the foreign world if we sat around and did nothing, and then said "Sorry we ignored your Genocide, but we decided to wait a decade to pay off our debts before we sent you any troops or medical aid."


And do you think it's okay to spread some of our ideals such as that blind hatred is wrong (Iran)?
There's a fine line between spreading an ideal and spreading a universal truth. Blind hatred is wrong. You can argue about spreading the american brand of democracy and capitalism, but trying to squelch hatred is a noble and necessary goal.

[phattonez]

The Communists say that they are still in control.


HAVANA (Reuters) - Cuba's Communist Party on Thursday stressed it would stay in control no matter what happened to convalescent leader
Fidel Castro, but failed to clear up doubts over who is in charge of the island.

In a typically cryptic message analysts said was designed to dispel fears of a disorderly transition of power, the main Communist newspaper Granma printed part of an old speech by Cuba's temporary leader, Castro's brother Raul.

In the speech, delivered on June 14 to army officers and first printed in Granma the following day, Raul Castro said, "Only the Communist Party .... can be the worthy heir of the trust Cubans have placed in their leader."

Fidel Castro, a notorious workaholic whose 80th birthday is August 13, temporarily handed over power as president and commander in chief to his brother on Monday after undergoing surgery to stop intestinal bleeding.

Raul Castro, Cuba's defense minister and regarded as competent but uncharismatic, has long been known to be his successor. He is 75 years old.

Castro's old enemy, the United States, says it believes the one-time guerrilla, the world's longest-serving head of government, is still alive.

Despite a surface calm on the streets of Havana, many Cubans had told foreign reporters they wanted Raul to show someone is in control by making a public appearance.

But analysts said the leadership probably considered that if Raul appeared too early, it might panic Cubans by confirming that Fidel's rule was over.

"If I were going to try to suggest to the Cuban people at the moment that what we have is tranquillity, absolute continuity and a large team more in place than ever, the last thing I would do is make a national broadcast as in a time of crisis," said Hal Klepak, professor of history at the Royal Military College of Canada and an author of book on Cuba's military.

Klepak, who is in Havana doing research, said he had seen Raul Castro drive by in a motorcade close to Revolution Square on Thursday and that pedestrians stopped to see him pass and drivers leaned out of cars to get a better look.

"Everyone broke out into applause, and even quite a few "Vivas!," said Klepak.

CALM IN HAVANA

Fidel Castro, who took power in 1959 when he led his ragged revolutionaries into Havana and has resisted almost permanent pressure for his overthrow from the United States, released a message on Tuesday saying he did not know if he would recover.

While close aide Ricardo Alarcon told a U.S. radio program on Wednesday that Castro was "very alert" and resting earlier in the week, Cubans are still desperate for information.

"Why hasn't Raul come out and spoken? That's what is needed," said a Havana delivery man on Thursday, asking not to be identified. "There is a dreadful calm here."

Despite wild celebrations at the news of the handover of power among Cuban exiles in Miami across the Florida Straits, there has been no sign here of unrest or that communist rule could collapse in an Eastern-European-style uprising.

While Cubans' lives have gotten tougher since the collapse of the Soviet Union and the capital Havana is falling to bits, the Communist Party exercises control in all areas of life. There is a lot of grumbling, but Cubans are still proud of free health and education.

Since Monday, people have gone about their normal business although there has been a small increase in police presence in poorer parts of the capital and communist neighborhood organizations said "rapid response groups" used to put down riots in the past had been activated.

Dan Erikson, analyst at the Inter-American Dialogue think tank in Washington, said Cubans might have to wait some more before they know for certain who their leader is going to be.

"Cuban leaders may be evaluating whether Fidel is ready to be seen publicly before allowing Raul to present a stronger image," he said.

"Even if Fidel's operation goes well, there is no such thing as minor surgery for an 80-year-old man, and his convalescence may take many months."