Shadow the Hedgehog: Pile on the hate

[jman2050]

I normally don't post here anymore, but as AGN's resident Sonic fanboy, I could not let this go unpunished:

http://media.cube.ign.com/media/734/734824/imgs_1.html

If you need me, I'll be in my room eviscerating myself.

[ONeilcool]

Can you blame them? i mean, guns in a game can sometimes sell it. GTA wouldnt be as good if you couldnt get out of the car and shoot people. Also the "dark" kind of game is catching on ,so shadow is made to fit in. Going fast doesn't cut it anymore

[jman2050]

Can you blame them? i mean, guns in a game can sometimes sell it. GTA wouldnt be as good if you couldnt get out of the car and shoot people. Also the "dark" kind of game is catching on ,so shadow is made to fit in. Going fast doesn't cut it anymore

Get out of my thread.

[ZomfgIts0rzlolo]

H8h8h8h8h8h8h8

[Axel]

He's got a point regarding the appeal of Shadow, as a darker character. The guns, though, I don't get. The usual Sonic weapons should be enough for anyone. But then, most of the recent Sonic games have left the roots behind and sucked for it.

[vegeta1215]

I felt compelled to make this thread when I first heard about Shadow the Hedghog: http://www.armageddongames.net/showthread.php?t=84602

It sounds like they're adding some variety with the weapons, Shadow's special moves, and the light/dark path, but I hear the flaws that plagued Sonic Heroes such as the camera are still present. C'mon Sega, how long will it take for you to fix your camera?!?

[Cloral]

I played this at e3. I only played for about a minute. I couldn't play any longer it was so bad.

[Vivionsho]

I think sega is starting to lose there touch....I mean come on, gun wielding hedgehog?! they are getting desprate ;)

[zoraking]

What happened to the old Sonic's where you'd jump and it'd kill a baddie? Now we are compelled to raise chao, weild guns, and *gulp* speak. I h8 SEGA.

[algam86]

I admit, Sonic Heroes did it for me. I never played it, but when I saw no stage had a checkpoint, you had to control three players at once, and it seemed to be pretty hard...well, I thought their time was up. I'll stick with my 2D Sonics for the rest of my life, because they're -fun-, yet simple.

SEGA needs a dirt nap.

P.S. Does anyone else think this is one of those games that actually looks pretty good, but you know it'll suck?

[Masamune]

I thought he was gonna get like... I unno.... A plasma gun maybe? That wouldn't be so bad. Or maybe a gun inside some sort of wrist garment? Hedgehogs don't carry assault rifles. :(

[vegeta1215]

I admit, Sonic Heroes did it for me. I never played it, but when I saw no stage had a checkpoint, you had to control three players at once, and it seemed to be pretty hard...

There are checkpoints in Sonic Heroes. Also, you don't control all three characters at once - you control the leader of the team, and can switch between who is in the lead. Depending on who leads, you can perform different abilities. It's actually pretty easy.

The game does have some issues, but the team aspect is pretty cool. Really, it's not that bad of a game.

[AlexMax]

I'm actually looking forward to this game. The sonic series hasn't has a great game since Sonic and Knuckles 3, and I actually was enterained the most by the shooting stages in Sonic Adventure 2...the sonic/shadow stages were fun but boring as hell and the knux/rogue stages made me want to gouge my eyes out.

[Vivionsho]

sonic/shadow stages were fun but boring as hell and the knux/rogue stages made me want to gouge my eyes out.
Yeah i would have to agree with you on that one, the kuckles and rouge missions were frustrating and forever repeatitive, but I also agree with the arm garment, would seem more realistic to the fantasy of the game instead of rampaging hedgehogs running around with assualt rifles!

[Aegix Drakan]

I'm with Alexmax on this one. I am also looking foreward to getting this game. and just for the record, I am a sonic fan too.

You don't need to use guns all the time, they just speed up combat. you can still do the famous homing attack, and spin dash. it's just faster to use guns because you can shoot and run, so you can blow through enemy formation without having to stop and do a homing attack on each one. really useful if you are trying to set a time record.

second, there are a variety of weapons, yes including plasma weapons (alien design), sword, street signs, etc. so you don't always need to use a gun.

thirdly, the camera and controls have been seriously improved since sonic heroes.

finally, you can actually choose your own path in this game, there are three diferent path you can take (good, neutral, evil) and you can switch at any time.

[EDIT] BTW Vivionsho, Shadow is not on a rampage, he is trying to recover his lost memories. you can either side with G.U.N and defend the Earth, or you can side with the Black Arms (aliens) and destroy the earth. it's all up to you which side you choose.

[Tygore]

I've heard that there are 10 endings, with an 11th "True" ending where you play in Super form. Very nice.

[DarkDragoonX]

Can you blame them?

Yes. Yes I can. Putting guns in a Sonic game is fucking retarded. It was bad enough that they started setting the games on "Earth," interacting with humans and such. It was bad enough thtat they made the characters speak. Now they have to add crap like guns? Jesus.


Going fast doesn't cut it anymore

As a matter of fact, it does. just about everybody loves the Sonic/Shadow levels in SA2. What's killing the series is this strange compulsion Sega seems to have with messing with the formula. They want you to play as all these diferent characters, and nobody wants to - everyone just want to run fast with Sonic. They try to add strange mini-games like raising Chao, but we don't want to - we just want to run fast with Sonic. In the original SA, they wanted us to explore areas to find the next stage, ala Mario 64... you guessed it, we just wanted to run fast with Sonic.

Every failure in the 3D Sonic games is because they tried to break away from the traditional formula. Why they keep trying over and over to change a formula nobody wants changed is beyond me.

[Vivionsho]

Yes. Yes I can. Putting guns in a Sonic game is fucking retarded. It was bad enough that they started setting the games on "Earth," interacting with humans and such. It was bad enough thtat they made the characters speak. Now they have to add crap like guns? Jesus.



As a matter of fact, it does. just about everybody loves the Sonic/Shadow levels in SA2. What's killing the series is this strange compulsion Sega seems to have with messing with the formula. They want you to play as all these diferent characters, and nobody wants to - everyone just want to run fast with Sonic. They try to add strange mini-games like raising Chao, but we don't want to - we just want to run fast with Sonic. In the original SA, they wanted us to explore areas to find the next stage, ala Mario 64... you guessed it, we just wanted to run fast with Sonic.

Every failure in the 3D Sonic games is because they tried to break away from the traditional formula. Why they keep trying over and over to change a formula nobody wants changed is beyond me.
I like flying fast with tails and I like being fat with robotnick

BTW Drakan, yes if an hedghog with guns is on the streets of earth and is out for revenge he is RAMPAGING

[Orion]

I think a game where you simply "run fast as sonic" in 3D would be pretty dull. It would seem a bit too "on rails" for me.

[Aegix Drakan]

Vivionsho, you do not have to go and get revenge, you can give up on your vengeance against G.U.N. and save the world from impending destruction. YOU choose how the game turns out.

Besides, apparently sonicteam made a poll about what the next sonic game should be like, and the overwhelming response was "I want a game with shadow in it where you can do whatever you want, and use weapons" That is how the game Idea got out there.

[Vivionsho]

Vivionsho, you do not have to go and get revenge, you can give up on your vengeance against G.U.N. and save the world from impending destruction. YOU choose how the game turns out.

Besides, apparently sonicteam made a poll about what the next sonic game should be like, and the overwhelming response was "I want a game with shadow in it where you can do whatever you want, and use weapons" That is how the game Idea got out there.
Ah i see now, but wasn't his objective to destroy all human race for killing Maria?
I am less informed on the game.

BTW( I am always skeptic before i play a game, so my mind might change once i played it, I thought XBOX was stupid until i played it and same thing with PS2, dont ask why I just did at the time, but anyway, now that i think about it. It would be cool to see a shadow game with weapons.)

[Aegix Drakan]

who the heck told you that the objective was to destroy the human race?

Th estory is, Shadow is trying to remember his past, and then one day a swarm of aliens (Called Black Arms) invade earth looking for chaos emeralds. GUN fights back, and shadow doesn't want to get involved. he gets contacted by Black doom (alien leader) who tells him of a supposed agreement they had, where Shadow would give them chaos emeralds, and they would restore his memory.

Of course, it falls on the player to decide whether or not to trust black doom, or to side with GUN, save earth and try to get back the memories another way. go to the official site for more details.
(thank you for opening your mind Vivionsho)

and to anyone who says "OH NO A SONIC GAME WITH GUNS!" It's actually a shadow game with guns.

[Saffith]

who the heck told you that the objective was to destroy the human race?The character's objective, not the game's.


The ARK was shut down under the premise that there had been an 'accident'. I found Maria's name among those who died when the ARK was shut down. She meant everything to me! And I couldn't bear the thought that she died because of my research. I lost everything! I had nothing more to live for! I went insane!! All I could think about, was to avenge her! Somehow, some way, I got scared as I no longer was able to control my thoughts. All I could think about, was that I wanted it all to end. Based on my original projections, I was able to complete my project; Shadow. I designed its mind to be perfect, pure... I will leave everything, to him. If you wish, release and awaken it, if you wish to fill the world with destruction.
Not what he ended up doing, obviously, but that was the original idea.

[Kevin]

This is just Sega stereotypically giving a black character a gun.

[jman2050]

Iam still playing this on the off-chance this is a good game. If it is, I will still be sad because it will perpetuate Sonic Team into messing with the original formula further. The best level of SA2 was the Green Hill remake. A 2-minute remake of a level we've all played a thousand times ended up being better than pretty much the rest of the game. That saddened me, because it just made me realize how much I want, nay, how much I NEED a 3D sonic that atually plays like Sonic, not a 3D Sonic that plays like Jak II (which I hated, btw).

As for the story, I can read up on that on any message board within days of release, so why would I play the game for story?

[vegeta1215]

That saddened me, because it just made me realize how much I want, nay, how much I NEED a 3D sonic that atually plays like Sonic

With the exception of some of the parts when you stop to fight, I thought Sonic Heroes played a lot like the old Sonic games (and the team aspect made it a little more interesting) :shrug:

[Axel]

Actually, yeah. Although the bosses were off (being way to easy) the actual level progression of Sonic Heroes wasn't bad. The bonus stages on the other hand....

[copsgotguns]

my expectations on sega for making a good sonic game drops each time they make a new one. knuckles was my favorite character until they tried to make him into indiana jones in sa2. if i want to play a decent sonic game i have to dust off the old game gear and frantically search the entire house for 6 batteries.

[jessethe2nd]

Ok, lets look at the whole shadow thing from sega's point of view. The video game industry's market has some what divided.You have your players who love big explosions, lots of action, fighting, ect, ect. You also have the more old school type of gamer who plays for the experience and not all the flash. Then there is what I believe to be the largest crowd, the mix of the two, some one who likes a great experience as well as an interesting story, nice visuals and action. Now sega for a while has appealed to the old school gamer with its hit series sonic the hedgehog. Now this sort of game does not appeal to all gamers, thus the need to create a game to appeals to the other group and especially the inbetween. Anyone care to guess which group shadow is meant to appeal to? Sega realized that it would make more money if it appealled to both groups and began work on Sa2 in which they introduced shadow. There was a problem with this, shadow is not really a character that is typical of a hero in a sonic game. Sega more than likely knew this and intended it to be that way (what better way to launch a character than to introduce him/her through another game). This game would be sega's first and hopefully final attempt to make the sonic series appeal to the majority of gamers. Now shadow is what would be labeled by many people as cool. For this he appeals to the masses. This is why there is the game shadow the hedge hog. It is not sonic the hedge hog but its own series (assuming it sells well). By creating This game sega can appeal to a new crowd, possibly draw in some of the old sonic fans and if they wish take the sonic series back to it's roots and appeal to the sonic fan of old.
---------------------------------------------That being said--------

I personnally liked Sa2, It reminded me of the old sonic games for some reason... If it was to drop the shooting and treasure hunting stages and kept the sonic/ shadow stages I feel it would have been fairly similair. About Sa1, It did greatly vary from the typical sonic style and for that I believe it did suck.

On a side note I am looking forward to shadow the hedge hog.

[Vivionsho]

I play alot of video games for the story adn some of the action :D

The story keeps me interested, but the new shadow game now that i think about it, swords would be sweet in a sonic game!

[zoraking]

The reason I hate all the 3D games are because of the sentimental value from the old-school ones. I remember staying up all night with my brother being Tails on Sonic 2 every Friday. Now these new games have speech which really blows my mind as to why Tails' voice keeps changing. And now a shooting game? I LOATHE shooting games. they always make me sick to my stomach (especially 1st persons).

[Darth Marsden]

I think a game where you simply "run fast as sonic" in 3D would be pretty dull. It would seem a bit too "on rails" for me.Ahem. Sonic Rush, anyone? That game is going to rock BIG-TIME.

Okay, back on-topic. Just to warn you, this is a BIG post. Didn't mean it to be, but it ended up as one. You've been warned.

I'm getting a bit irritated by this now. I like Sonic games. I'll admit, I like the old 2D games better then the 3D ones, but that's mainly because the 2D ones stuck to what worked and didn't deviate from that. They didn't have you digging in the ground for rings or blowing stuff up (beyond Robotnik's machines). They had you running through levels, smahing robots and jumping over spikes. That's what I loved about them.

In the next-gen Sonic games (Sonic Adventure onwards) they deviated from that. In SA1, they tried to introduce a bit of open-ness to it, by adding an adventure field. That doesn't work anymore because after completing the Story part, I've now forgoteen how to access half the levels. Also, every style of gameplay besides Sonic sucked. DO NOT GET ME STARTED ABOUT BIG THE CAT.

In SA2, they introduced three different styles of gameplay. Sonic/Shadow levels were pretty cool, bringing back some fond memories of the old days (especially with the remake of green Hill Zone, that was pretty cool). Sadly, the Tales/Robotnik sections weren't that hot and the Knuckles/Rouge search-o-rama levels sucked big time.

SH came along and tried to revitalise the series. The speed was there, certainly. But sometimes, you need more then just speed. Heroes forgot about plot. So Robotnik is back - why? What's his latest scheme? Does he even have one? Other issues include leves that make no sense, some dodgy clipping and a very naughty camera.

This latest game is adding even more to the mix. While I like that you can forgo weapons for the most part and just jump on your enemies like the old days, that doesn't detract from the fact that Sega is tinkering with the formula yet again. But, and here's what we all really have to remember - we don't really know what it's like because IT'S NOT OUT YET. I'm going to reserve comment on it until it's been released, but I really hope Sega knows what it's doing,because for some reason, I feel like their in this mindframe at the moment:

http://www.vgcats.com/comics/images/050314.jpg

[vegeta1215]

Actually, yeah. Although the bosses were off (being way to easy) the actual level progression of Sonic Heroes wasn't bad. The bonus stages on the other hand....

I forgot about the bonus stages...yeah, they're pretty terrible. It looked like they were trying to emulate the bonus stages in Sonic 2 (which were great), but it didn't work out. It's a shame you have to collect all the chaos emeralds by winning the bonus stages to unlock the final level against Metal Sonic.

I also thought the enemies in Sonic Heroes were pretty dull. I liked the variety of the botniks in the older Sonic games that looked like animals, and had creatures inside that you had to set free.



But sometimes, you need more then just speed. Heroes forgot about plot. So Robotnik is back - why? What's his latest scheme? Does he even have one? Other issues include leves that make no sense, some dodgy clipping and a very naughty camera.

Sonic can keep on stopping Robotnik from stealing the chaos emeralds for all I care, the story doesn't really matter to me.

[Vivionsho]

:laughing: That comic about the new shadow game was good

[Cloral]

I was plaing sonic 2 the other day, and I realized one of the things that made the older sonic games great was the exploration. Don't get me wrong, I don't mean anything like SA1. In all the older games you were almost always trying to get to the right end of the zone where the exit was. However, you usually had many possible routes by which you could get there. And the route you chose affected the obstacles you faced - for instance, one route might have a lot of enemies, but another might have you jumping to moving platforms. And so while many talk about going fast as what was great about the older sonic games, I think the best thing was the combination. Sure you could go fast, and in many areas going fast was beneficial. But you also had to keep your eyes open so you could spot that ledge before you went running past. Later games tend to keep you on a single path, and I think that is a huge mistake.

[jman2050]

I was plaing sonic 2 the other day, and I realized one of the things that made the older sonic games great was the exploration. Don't get me wrong, I don't mean anything like SA1. In all the older games you were almost always trying to get to the right end of the zone where the exit was. However, you usually had many possible routes by which you could get there. And the route you chose affected the obstacles you faced - for instance, one route might have a lot of enemies, but another might have you jumping to moving platforms. And so while many talk about going fast as what was great about the older sonic games, I think the best thing was the combination. Sure you could go fast, and in many areas going fast was beneficial. But you also had to keep your eyes open so you could spot that ledge before you went running past. Later games tend to keep you on a single path, and I think that is a huge mistake.

Nail, meet Head. Head? Nail.

Granted, Sonic Heroes tried to accomplish this again. And I think it did a reasonable job of allowing you to explore, at least considering the fact that it's in 3D. It was just a whole crapload of other issues that ruined Heroes, but that's a discussion for another day.

Green Hill is the best zone in SA2 for this reason as well. Yes, it was really short. But my god, I could go through that small little 2-minute stage in so many different ways it was ridiculous. Stay high, stay low, jump around, go between high and low, take the classic curvy tunnel below or jump on the moving platforms above. It was so much fun just replaying the level over and over again. If they can recapture THAT aspect of the platforming, fix the camera, and stop distracting us with out-of-place gimmicks, it would be an awesome 3D Sonic game. I loved SA and SA2, but not neccesarily because they were Sonic games.

And on that note, I'll soothe my pain by posting the link to the REAL premiere (http://sonic-rush.net/en/index.html) Sonic game of 2005

[mrz84]

i saw a preview for this in EGM and was like: shadow is getting his own game. sw33t. the gun threw me off a bit, but what the hey. you jsut have to understand that the gaming indusrty does pretty much what it wants as long as they think they can get money out of it. same holds true for most other industries. sonic heroes I only played for Team Dark. Shadow is cool. Now if you'll excuse, me I shall take my leave. :kawaii:

[Axel]

One thing that my bro and I agree is lousy about the new Sonics is the chaos emeralds. In Sonic 3 & Knuckles we seriously enjoyed having Super and Hyper in any level. It was a major disappointment having them only available in the final levels. And with Heroes we at least thought every character would get super, seemed necessary for them to keep the final level formula they've been using. Disappointed there too.

[Vivionsho]

One thing that my bro and I agree is lousy about the new Sonics is the chaos emeralds. In Sonic 3 & Knuckles we seriously enjoyed having Super and Hyper in any level. It was a major disappointment having them only available in the final levels. And with Heroes we at least thought every character would get super, seemed necessary for them to keep the final level formula they've been using. Disappointed there too.


Yeah Axel, you have a piont about the Heros not having supers for all the characters, would've been nice to see them all in super mode.

They used to always have that final level when you were super sonic and stuff and on SA2 you got to be super shadow which was awesome.

Hopefully they will pull through in Shadow the Hedgehog...

[Aegix Drakan]

Super Shadow has been confirmed in the game, along with all the characters from sonic heroes.

racing Vs mode confirmed (unlockable characters)

Death match vs mode (shadow androids only) confirmed

[Vivionsho]

Super Shadow has been confirmed in the game, along with all the characters from sonic heroes.

racing Vs mode confirmed (unlockable characters)

Death match vs mode (shadow androids only) confirmed
Wow thats a first unlockable characters..

[Aegix Drakan]

^^^ :D Actually, it's a second (if you count Sonic R)

[Vivionsho]

^^^ :D Actually, it's a second (if you count Sonic R)
Is that Sonic Racing?

[Aegix Drakan]

Yeah it is Sonic Racing, but the title is Sonic R.

what sucks though is once oyu unlock characters in that game, you stop using the old ones entirely, because then they will suck in comparison.

[Vivionsho]

:rofl: heh I never got to play Sonic R becuase of the consol it was on, I forgot what the consol was, wasn't it Sega Saturn?

[Aegix Drakan]

I have it on PC. but I realized it's a demo version because although everything is playable, there is no music. (sucks big time)
I have become way too good at the game, I can beat it on hard mode at 100% in one morning.

[edit] I think we're going off topic, better get back on track.

swearing is confirmed in Shadow the hedgehog, but how much, I'm not sure, seeing as it got an E-10 rating from the sissies at ERSB (they gave Starfox adventures a T rating for suggestive themes. WHAT FREAKING SUGGESTIVE THEMES???)

[Darth Marsden]

Just a quick note - Sonic R is on the Sonic Gems Collection compilation, along with Sonic the Fighters (which sucks) and Sonic CD (which doesn't).

[Vivionsho]

swearing is confirmed in Shadow the hedgehog, but how much, I'm not sure, seeing as it got an E-10 rating from the sissies at ERSB (they gave Starfox adventures a T rating for suggestive themes. WHAT FREAKING SUGGESTIVE THEMES???)


I know the ERSB make stupid ratings like rated T for Animated Voilence, I mean Voilence i can understand and blood & Gore

[jman2050]

Stop ruining my thread you... you Shadow the Hedgehog sympathizers.

Don't make me move this to GB :)

[Vivionsho]

I'm sorry but what is "GB"? I've never heard it before...

EDIT: Is it General Bitching?

I think Sonic Heros was a let down for me...the story wasn't really good and the multiplayer was annoying having to play over and over to get whatever you needed to unlock stuff, I liked the old 2d sonics just fine.

But then again the 2d sonics didn't have anything for story besides beat up Dr. Robotnick...some of the sonics like SA1 and SA2 where good the multiplayer was entertaining and the story was interesting, more deeper if you will.

[Darth Marsden]

You don't know GB stands for General Bitching? n00b. :p

I've mentioned it before, but it's started to be reviewed now, and the critics agree - Sonic Rush is one of the best Sonic games EVER. If you have a DS, then do give it a try. I'd love to know what people whom I actually (kinda) know think about it.

[Dechipher]

I think it's stupid, the way they changed the sonic format. Just because you CAN do 3D doesn't mean you SHOULD. Imagine a Sonic game where the levels looked crystal clear. Characters moved flawlessly. And the bonus stages from Sonic 2...they would look FANTASTIC. I've never understood why you can't incorporate 2D with 3D in a good way. You don't have to worry about stupid camera angles or enemies coming from behind you. Honestly, I think they should revert to that format. But....whatever.

[Yoshiman]

I think it's stupid, the way they changed the sonic format. Just because you CAN do 3D doesn't mean you SHOULD. Imagine a Sonic game where the levels looked crystal clear. Characters moved flawlessly. And the bonus stages from Sonic 2...they would look FANTASTIC. I've never understood why you can't incorporate 2D with 3D in a good way. You don't have to worry about stupid camera angles or enemies coming from behind you. Honestly, I think they should revert to that format. But....whatever.
Chances are, this would turn the majority of softcore gamers away. At school, I heard someone saying that Viewtiful Joe was stupid because it was a sidescroller (but then again, the majority of people at my school are graphic whores).

I'm not sure if I'm gonna try this game or not. I'd rather have a Sonic game that actually fit the original Sonic formula than something with guns and vehicles. Sonic's levels in SA1 were pretty good, but the lobby-type thing was a little tedious.

I kinda liked Sonic Heroes. The camera could've used some work, but it did stay close to the original formula. The Sonic Advance games are a pretty good example of what Sonic should be.

http://media.cube.ign.com/media/734/734824/img_3191423.html
... And this screen just reminds me of something from Grand Theft Auto. Rebel-type person in a stolen vehicle with a gun.

[Darth Marsden]

http://media.cube.ign.com/media/734/734824/img_3191423.html
... And this screen just reminds me of something from Grand Theft Auto. Rebel-type person in a stolen vehicle with a gun.If I had a nickle for every time a game had been 'inspired' by Grand Theft Auto in some way, I'd have about $24. And the irritating thing is, none of them are ever as good as GTA. Most of them just come across as inferior games. It may be what the kids want these days, but sometimes you wish the programmers would just take a step back and say "Woah. This... isn't all that great."

The more I hear about Shadow, the less confident I feel about it. Maybe if we all stop talking, it'll get better. Maybe..?

[jman2050]

http://eurogamer.net/article.php?article_id=61699

Excellent >:D

[Darth Marsden]

Dude, it's 5/10. That's not cool!

[jman2050]

Dude, it's 5/10. That's not cool!

Exactly.

[Darth Marsden]

Well, Amazon.Com is FINALLY shipping it out to me, so I'll have a play in a couple of days and see what I think. Interestingly, it's also sending me the Sonic Gems Collection, despite me having bought another copy. Patience is a virtue it seems I lack. :(

[jman2050]

http://xbox.ign.com/articles/667/667942p1.html

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Sega's trash will never prevail! :D

[Darth Marsden]

After finishing Sonic Heroes (grumble grumble, final b attle against Robotnik doesn't make any sense, grumble grumble), I've played this.

...oh dear.

I'm not touching it again until I find some Action Replay codes to give me infinite lives. I keep flying off ledges into space/liquid/whatever. Very irritating indeed. That first review you posted got it spot on. Why can't Sonic Team make a decent 3D Sonic? They're good for 2D stuff, but 3D... man, they're just lost. They so need to let someone else have a go. Couldn't be any worse then their attempts.