Tile and Palette/CSet problems [Archive]

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Scotian Gold

08-31-2005, 03:51 PM

O�* gente,

I've come across something insteresting and I want to see how people here would deal with it.

Go into one of your quests and make a screencap of some dungeon tiles, doesn't matter what palette and Cset. Without changing your palette/Cset, try to import this GIF/BMP back on top of those files. Are you able to reproduce the same colour for the tiles? When I go to Grab > File, the colours are all strange, even though if I click the Pal button it shows that the palette of the GIF/BMP *matches* the tiles I will overwrite - but I cannot get the colours to appear.

(You may be asking, why isn't he copying and pasting tiles? Well, I do want to take tiles from one quest into another without overwriting my existing set. But for now, by working with only one quest, no one will need to worry about having palettes/csets set up correctly)

Have fun!
Scotian Gold

Zelda_Warrior

08-31-2005, 04:18 PM

They arn't the same color becuase the quest you are trying to rip from probably has a different pallette, rip the pallette from teh screenshot.

Btw, in ZC, 'pal' dosen't make the colors like that, it only lets you see the original color.

Freedom

08-31-2005, 05:43 PM

I guess I didn't explain this too well in the PM.
Few tilesets use the same palettes, so grabbing a bmp image from one tileset into another will most likely mean your colors are different.
You can either recolor the image, or you can grab the palette from the image, OR you can just open the other quest you are ripping from and transfer the palette that way.

Scotian Gold

09-01-2005, 12:51 AM

Ok, I think grabbing the palette from the image will work. Both of you were concerned that I didn't have my palettes set up correctly, but I do: The existing dungeon tiles in the Pure dataset are looking EXACTLY like I want my imported dungeon set to be. So I DEFINITELY have the palette set up properly.

Here's what I think happens when you try to bring a GIF file into ZQ...ZQ 'maps' the colours in a different order than your palette. So even though you're using the same palette, everything looks wonky. For example, here are the colour orders between Pure's Main CSet 2 and importing a GIF that was screencapped from tiles using this CSet:

CSET > GIF
----------
1) Transparent > Transparent
2) Lightest Grey > Brown
3) Light Grey > Khaki
4) Grey > Darker Grey
5) Darker Grey > Darker Green
6) Green > Gold
7) Darker Green > Grey
8) White > Green
9) Blue > Tan
10) Tan > Blue
11) Gold > Grey
12) Khaki > Light Grey
13) Salmon > Lightest Grey
14) Pink-Brown > White
15) Brown > Black
16) Black > Black

I hope you all followed that!

So what I discovered is that you CANNOT import a image file and expect it to work with ANY existing palette in ANY existing quest. You have to import the image's palette along with the image because - even if your image uses all 16 colours of an exisiting CSet - the order of the colours in its CSet will not match the order of colours in your existing CSet.

Did I mention the words palette, colour, image and CSet enough for you? *Mojojojo evil laughter*

Hope this helps at least one person here!

Boa noite,
Scotian Gold

Freedom

09-01-2005, 02:05 AM

So what I discovered is that you CANNOT import a image file and expect it to work with ANY existing palette in ANY existing quest

This is incorrect, it only applies if the cset was set up in a different order.
IF you are grabbing from a set the same as yours then the palette will probably match.
Using photo and paint programs can sometimes rearrange your colors also, so care needs to be used when using them.

Scotian Gold

09-01-2005, 09:47 AM

Freedom, I didn't say it was impossible, I said that you shouldn't expect it to work! :)

What are the odds of all 16 colours of an existing CSet aligning in the same order with the 16 colours of your image when it's imported? Very, very slim, I would say, as there are 20, 922, 789, 888, 000 possible combinations that 16 colours can be ordered in (if I remembered how to do factorials correctly)

Both 256 colour GIFs ands true colour BMPs import image CSets in the same order, though I'm not sure what this order is - perhaps by number of pixels of colour, from most to least. Or perhaps it just uses an internal order defined by the file (which is visible in PhotoPaint, Photoshop). So you could have two images using the same 16 colours and it is possible (likely) that they each will have a differently ordered CSet.

Scotian Gold