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idontknow
12-11-2004, 06:03 PM
What should be the next big feature for zquest that should be worked on?
A) Complete NPCs (with movement, dialogue, and other such behaviors, including full functionality overworld dmaps!)
B) Custom Enemy Editor
C) Pick-Up Blocks (like push blocks, except Link can lift them and then throw or drop them, and other such items that link can pick up, like rocks)
D) New Items (such as implementing Farore's Wind and Nayru's Love, possibly a Lightening rod, rock's feather, etc.)
E) Sound Effects Editor (possibly be able to choose what file sound effects use to replace default sound effects, and editing such files with the grabber tool, and also being able to include new sound effects, such as breaking pots, thunder, etc.)
F) Global Triggers or Events...having new flags that would trigger something on another screen, without using boss flags, trigger enemies, and such!
G) Weather effects! Being able to have link's and enemies' pallettes change on a specific screens to simulate change in darkness, or for a volcanic effect in a fire dungeon, etc, and other such "weather" effects.

*b*
12-11-2004, 07:02 PM
I voted for an enemy editor. if I could have voted for two things, it would have been Global Triggering as well. both would allow much more versatility in ZQuest

Jarty
12-11-2004, 10:11 PM
Wouldn't NPC's require some form of scripting? And if so, could it also be applied elsewhere?

Blonde799
12-11-2004, 10:19 PM
How about H) VARIABLES!?:D

An enemy editor would be the most influental addition among those listed.

ShadowTiger
12-11-2004, 10:38 PM
I think adding more sound slots would be prime. Would that be easy to do? ... Basically, this is implying something like the background lava bubbling of the OoT Fire Temple, or gears grinding, motors revving, (You'd be surprised what you can truly do in ZC. ;) :D ) etc. So far, all we can work with is the waterfall SFX, boss roars, and a few others. We'd even have to go so far as to replace the Pick Up SFX if you want a particular effect done. (The Wind Waker boss-defeated sound.)

Orion
12-12-2004, 09:00 PM
Next big project... break for DN, FCF and the beta testers :P

4matsy
12-16-2004, 11:42 PM
Hmm...

One thing I've been thinking about recently that no one's really mentioned: having ZC's palette system overhauled.

Odd, I know, but the way I'm thinking of would allow a lot more flexibility...

- Main idea is, there would be this "master CSet bank" where a single copy of every CSet in the quest would be stored...
- You could specify which CSets out of the master bank to use for level palettes. Every level palette would consist of what is now CSet 0 through 11 as well as Extra Sprite Palettes...in other words, you could define boss and Link's ring colors per level, and also the whole range of 0 to 11, rather than just 2, 3, 4, and 9.
- You could also set up palette cycling in the same way, referencing the cycling CSets from the master bank.
- Eliminating the "Dark"/"Cycle" fiasco, just enabling them both permanently regardless of whether Interpolated Fading is on. Dark would simply work on the master bank's currently selected CSet; and Cycle would be unchanged, opening the dialog to set up the palette cycles...
- Caves and passageways, you would also be able to specify a level palette for. A and B are the only two level palettes remaining that're hard-coded to a particular location...

This would, for example, allow the Zelda Challenge: Outlands palettes to be accurately reproduced; as this system fits more in line with the original NES Zelda 1's palette usage, where all eight NES CSets (equivalent to ZC's 0, 1, 2, 3, 6, 7, 8, and 9) could be changed per level. I'm sure many other tilesets could benefit from this setup too somehow.

*looks around suspiciously, as if expecting to be bricked any second, and prepares to run*

...Oh, and it'd be real nice if ZC could run in 16-bit mode and use 256-color CSe--*is bricked, hard and fast, by the dozens, from a multitude of directions*

vegeta1215
12-17-2004, 09:30 AM
I think a custom enemy editor would be best. I remember reading that Phantom Menace had partially finished an enemy editor before he handed over ZC to War Lord back in late 2000.

By enemy editor, I don't mean one that would let you create new enemies, but one to edit current enemies. One that would make it easier to choose the tiles they use, the animations, the weapon type, how much damage they do and take, etc. Things like that.

NerdWarrior
12-22-2004, 01:14 PM
thI think it's time for an enemy editor. I'm tired of seeing non-Zelda quests and knowing what kind of enemy something is. Let me see a boss that shoots arrows. :P

DarkDragon
01-08-2005, 05:08 AM
The next *big* project?
Heh, well, in my opinion, the entire combo system confusing, limiting, and hacked-together; the fact that most modern quests are filled with what amounts to clever tricks is a good indication that combos are clunky relics whose time has come. I'm all for axing it *all* and replacing it with Megazeux-style scripting. Such would be powerful enough to encompass all of A, B, D to a limited extent, F, and G. With such a system and a few new hard-coded items, LttP Classic would be well within the realm of possibility.

Of couse the above is unrealistically ambitious; though I'll push for it till the day ZC is abandoned, shrivels up, and dies.

Hypercrash, extending CSets to 256 colors seems a relatively simple-to-implement, backwards-compatible step towards much nicer-looking tiles. Or is there some Allegro limitation restricting us to 256-color video modes?

Blonde799
01-08-2005, 06:50 AM
The next *big* project?
Heh, well, in my opinion, the entire combo system confusing, limiting, and hacked-together; the fact that most modern quests are filled with what amounts to clever tricks is a good indication that combos are clunky relics whose time has come.
Eh, I like the whole system of "giving an entity a soul". The fact that most modern quests are filled with what amounts to clever tricks is a good indication that combos are being used to their full potential, and then some. I really like seeing people use them for things that might not be originally intended, and coming up with something new. It puts more life into ZC than you thnk.

I'd hate to see ZC go the way of the "new" programs out there, that use all kinds of scripting codes and interfaces and stuff. That's why I stuck with ZC, because while being very limited, it was generally very easy to use. I've tried many programs that are techinically better than ZC, and I never got into any of them, because they were too intimidating(not easy enough to just pick up and use). I don't think any program out there can match what ZC is. It's very easy to use, while being surprisingly flexible.

The next big thing I think that should be worked on is implementing custom variables into ZC, or room specific scripts. Something like that opens up a lot of new doors, and allows people to make more doors if they want.:p

Ganonator
01-08-2005, 04:30 PM
Tester Reform. That's what I'm looking forward to.

Freedom
01-08-2005, 05:22 PM
The next thing that needs to be done is that cycling combo corrupting flaw that ruins quests needs to be fixed, as it is any quest with cycling combos becomes destroyed.
What good is adding new features if the quests can't be built on it as it is?
People really should stop asking for more more more until what's there works right.

DarkDragon
01-08-2005, 05:57 PM
The fact that most modern quests are filled with what amounts to clever tricks is a good indication that combos are being used to their full potential, and then some. I really like seeing people use them for things that might not be originally intended, and coming up with something new.
While the above is certaily true, such a state of affairs is unhealthy for the long-term development of ZC. There is only so much "then some" out there. Whereas combos were perfectly suited for the one-secret-per-room NES, to me it seems obvious that they are far too limiting for the kind of quests quest designers are currently pushing for. You're giving quest designers a block of wood and a butter knife, and clapping when they whittle something unexpectedly pretty - wouldn't you want to see what they could do with a laser scalpel, instead?
Have you ever played around with MZX? I'm not sure what "new" programs you were referring to, but in my experience Megazeux-like scripting provides an extreme power boost with a very small increase in complexity.

Basically, whenever I see people clamoring for "more combos!" or "global flags" or "enemy editor" or "room scripts", I cringe, because it seems clear to me that by piling on more small features on a weak foundation instead of overhauling that foundation, we are limiting ZC's potential. I want to see the day when opening up ZQuest and cranking out Link to the Past or Link's Awakening is a straightforward and simple endeavor.

EDIT: I didn't see your post, Freedom, before I replied, but I agree entirely. 2.10 is still far too buggy to be considered a "stable" release.

Blonde799
01-09-2005, 12:09 AM
Have you ever played around with MZX? I'm not sure what "new" programs you were referring to, but in my experience Megazeux-like scripting provides an extreme power boost with a very small increase in complexity.

Yeah. So does RPG Maker 2 though. It's pretty intimidating to some(because they don't pay attention to the help messages), but while it seems like "Ok, that's all there is?", it's capable of almost anything. You can make an entire menu system on your own by using simple materials, and a bit of imagination. Sort of like what ZC can do, only on a larger scale. Personally, I hope that's what ZC becomes in the future. Easy to use, while still having the potential to do lots of things.

And I agree with the whole compatibility thing, but we all know what the topic title says right?:p Right.

ShadowTiger
01-09-2005, 02:16 PM
Hm. Megazeux ... Damn, I wish that thing played on my PC. :shakeno: (Well, it does, but there's this nasty bug where every other action you do causes garbage to appear on the screen, and then is "cleared" in the next action. ... Dang.) If you've heard of Megazeux, you've also probably heard of ZZT. ZZT's abilities are to Megazeux what ZC is to ALTTP. ... They're clearly different programs, but you can do so much in each that the end result ends up being fairly similar. Although what ZC can do now is ... "clearly" ... a child's toy, as it might be stated here for whatever reason, as compared to an ALTTP / OpenZelda scripting game, there have been situations where if used in the right hands, the end result can be pretty fantastic. If you've ever played MMDWR or Radien's DoR Demo, you will see quite clearly that the ZC engine is almost always capable of more than we think.

We can argue for hours about what ZC can do and cannot do. But to overhaul its engine would be to change ZC entirely. If you want something greater than what ZC can do now, in terms of combos, tiles, palletes, and the "lack of programming," or whatever, go play OpenZelda. I'm sure you'll have a blast with it with a creative mind like yourss, DDragon.

Such an overhaul would obviously take major amounts of time, and could rock the very foundation of what we already have and send it BACKWARD several hundred (similarly major) steps, and make it anything but functional for the next few years at least, and make DN collapse under his computer into a trembling pile of fleshy goo out of stress. :odd: Naturally, nobody wants that. ;)

DarkDragon
01-09-2005, 03:53 PM
Yes, it would be unreasonable to ask such a major transformation of the developers; in this thread, I'm basically fantasizing. But in an ideal world I'd gladly walk a hundred steps back to walk two hundred forward.

Is Open Zelda reasonably operational? Last I checked, it was crippled by bugs, then it disappeared from AGN entirely. I heard it moved to GU, but haven't seriously researched it since.

ShadowTiger
01-09-2005, 05:14 PM
Yes, it would be unreasonable to ask such a major transformation of the developers; in this thread, I'm basically fantasizing. But in an ideal world I'd gladly walk a hundred steps back to walk two hundred forward. That's very noble of you. With enough determination, I'm sure ZC would become something truly revolutionary if given the chance. Truth be told, there is a small part of me that wishes ZC could do more. But then I open my eyes to quests like MMDWR, DoY, Sabotage Dragoon, DoR, ... and my fantasies erupt into reality. :)

Is Open Zelda reasonably operational? Last I checked, it was crippled by bugs, then it disappeared from AGN entirely. I heard it moved to GU, but haven't seriously researched it since. ... *lol* ... I haven't heard from it in a long time. The darn thing wouldn't even work on my computer. Still, I'll bet there are dozens of little fanmade engines out there.
(Replies In RBlue)

Orion
01-09-2005, 09:05 PM
With the kind of changes you talk about, you would almost be better off re-writing the entire engine from scratch. I'd much rather see this release cleaned up and some of the do-able features implimented. With some of the quests that quest-makers have been cranking out lately, I see no reason why we should abandon what has been working so well lately.

But I do agree that there are still some serious errors in this release that should be addressed before anything else is added.