Soldiers abuse prisoners in iraqi prison

[AlexMax]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/WORLD/meast/04/30/iraq.photos/index.html


"I share a deep disgust that those prisoners were treated the way they were treated," Bush said. "Their treatment does not reflect the nature of the American people. That's not the way we do things in America."

The photographs, which first aired Wednesday on CBS' "60 Minutes II" in the United States, were shown Friday by Arab television networks.

CNN has not verified the authenticity of the images.

"I didn't like it one bit," Bush added during an appearance in the White House Rose Garden with visiting Canadian Prime Minister Paul Martin.

The U.S. military said six U.S. soldiers have been charged with abusing inmates at Abu Ghraib, which was infamous under Saddam Hussein's reign.

White House press secretary Scott McClellan described the acts at the prison as "despicable."

"We cannot tolerate it, and the military is taking strong action against those responsible," McClellan said.

He said the president had known about the images for a while but declined to offer further details.

When asked about a potential worldwide backlash over the pictures, McClellan said, "It does not represent what we stand for, and I think the military has made it very clear that they are going to pursue -- to the fullest extent of the law -- these individuals."

In Iraq, a military official of the U.S.-led coalition also said the photos disgusted him.

Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, the coalition's deputy chief of operations, said that he was "appalled that fellow soldiers who wear the same uniforms as us would do this."

"... They crossed the line and violated every tenet we teach in the Army about dignity and respect," he said, adding that he was expressing his personal opinion and not speaking on the coalition's behalf.

CBS said it has dozens of pictures purportedly showing a wide range of abuse.

Some of the images published on one London-based newspaper's Web site show naked, hooded prisoners. In one, a male and a female soldier smile as they pose with prisoners.

One picture apparently shows an Iraqi prisoner standing on a box with his head covered and wires attached to his hands.

Kimmitt said he has met with representatives of Iraq's newspapers to discuss how to report the story. Iraq does not publish newspapers on Friday, the Muslim holy day.

But some Baghdad residents, who saw the images Friday, said the photographs angered them.

An investigation began in January after a soldier reported the alleged abuse to superiors, Kimmitt said this week.

Kimmitt declined to disclose the charges or other details, but he said military authorities take any such reports seriously.

"We are committed to treating all persons under coalition custody with dignity, respect and humanity," he said.

"Coalition personnel are expected to act appropriately, humanely and in a manner consistent with the Geneva Conventions."

In February, senior military officials said 17 troops, including a battalion commander, a company commander and 12 military police assigned to guard prisoners, had been relieved of duty until an investigation could be completed.
Expressions of shock among U.S. allies

British Prime Minister Tony Blair's human rights envoy to Iraq said Friday she was shocked by the images, while the editor of a London-based Arabic newspaper predicted Muslims would be furious.

Ann Clwyd, Blair's envoy and a lawmaker from the ruling Labor Party, voiced her condemnation. "I think they are absolutely terrible. I am shocked," she told British radio.

However, Clwyd said there was no comparison with how prisoners were treated under Saddam. "A small number of cases, horrible though they are -- you cannot compare that with the tens of thousands of people Saddam Hussein was responsible for executing and torturing."

Australian Prime Minister John Howard said Friday he was "appalled" by the images but praised the U.S. military for investigating.

British military expert Colonel Bob Stewart said the pictures would inflame an already volatile situation in the Arab world.

Stewart, NATO's former commander in Bosnia, told ITN the images were "the best recruiting sergeant that al Qaeda and those people that want to fight against British soldiers, American soldiers and the rest of coalition could ever want."

Photos also were splashed across many of Britain's newspapers. "We are losing their hearts and minds" was the headline in the Daily Mail's main editorial comment.

The Daily Mirror added: "When it comes to winning hearts and minds the U.S. Army hasn't got a clue. Many of its actions seem calculated to make enemies of Iraqis and drive them into the arms of extremists. The photos of prisoners being tortured ... are the most unforgivable acts yet."

Abdel Bari Atwan, editor of Al-Quds Al-Arabi newspaper in London, agreed. "It is absolutely shocking. I think this is the end of the story, the straw that broke the camel's back, for America," he told the UK Press Association.

"People will be extremely angry. ... Sexual abuse is the worst thing in that part of the world. It is shocking to all Muslims. America has lost the battle completely. I believe there will be more attacks."

Idiots. Way to win support of our allies, gg nextmap. This isn't just the soldiers doing this, but lots of other federal agencies were supposively involved with the torture or at least egging the soldiers on.

NOTE: Left wingers, right wingers, Bush is digusted at the way that these people were treated. So no "BUSH SUX LOL STOP THE WAR" from you lefties and no "LOL UR LEFT WING LOL" from you righties.

Read the above sentance. Comprehend the above sentance. Then post.

EDIT: Here are the pictures depicting the torture. (http://www.thememoryhole.org/war/iraqis_tortured/)

[theplustwo]

God damnit. How can these soldiers not see that they are committing the same crimes against other people that they went into the country to prevent?

[Starkist]

When Arab soldiers do it, the world shrugs, as if they expected it. It seems, whether consciously or not, that the United States is held to a much higher standard, even the Arabs see it. In every group of people, some are bad, whether the group is soldiers, priests, politicians, teachers, students, etc. Kudos for the investigation.

Makes me think of Henry V, Act III, Scene III anyhow.

[Brian]

When Arab soldiers do it, the world shrugs, as if they expected it. It seems, whether consciously or not, that the United States is held to a much higher standard, even the Arabs see it. In every group of people, some are bad, whether the group is soldiers, priests, politicians, teachers, students, etc. Kudos for the investigation.

That is true, and I think thats a good thing that we are held to a higher standard. It will irritate me somewhat if this launches the Muslim comunity into a big series of protests, because things worse than this went on all the time under Sadam and we didn't see many protests back then.

But that said from what I read and saw it seems like these were some sick people who were abusing the prisoners, and they should be locked up for the good of society everywhere. As Americans we ARE civilized and we should show our dignity this to the rest of the world, much of it being uncivilized.

On a personal note, who the hell would chose that of all things as a way to mistreat prisoners? They must of some strong sexual fetish problems.

[Starkist]

Far be it from me to defend any of these despicable acts, I don't mean to come across that way. Those who did this should be punished accordingly. However, I regret that this incident will be used to smear the US Armed Services and the US itself.

[Brian]

Hmm.... actually, I was basically agreeing with you. I guess we had a sort of miscommunication. :cool:

[Starkist]

I know, I was just clarifying.

[bigjoe]

All the "regulars" are out at full heat, including Alex "Jones" Max and Star "W." Kist. ;)

Interestingly, Brian, who is normally quiet, presides in this debate.

That being said, I'd like to offer one small opinion that even 'gravy' can't lay a hand on.

This is that human beings, in their essence, are a very beautiful thing. Unpredictable, lively, and joyful.

I could jump on the other side of the lines here and say that those people in masks are possibly not even Iraqis, or are possibly "posing for the camera." The pictures in themselves, while disturbing, didnt seem terribly downcast. Heck, it could have just been a whole bunch of gay people who were terribly bored and decided to wag the dog because of that.

Don't jump to obvious conclusions is what I've always tried to say. :cool: Human beings will be human beings, regardless of their ethnicity. And human beings, in my opinion, have a beauty the scope of which can never be touched. That beauty is reason.

I have defied what should have been the "Laws of Space and Time" by posting at these forums once more, when I shouldnt have. I'll leave you guys alone to tear eachother up about who is politically handling the problem correctly.