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Starkist
09-11-2003, 10:51 PM
Jerusalem Post Editorial: Kill Arafat
Thu Sep 11 2003 7:11 PT

The world will not help us; we must help ourselves. We must kill as many of the Hamas and Islamic Jihad leaders as possible, as quickly possible, while minimizing collateral damage, but not letting that damage stop us. And we must kill Yasser Arafat, because the world leaves us no alternative.

No one seriously argues with the fact that Arafat was preventing Mahmoud Abbas, the prime minister he appointed, from combating terrorism, to the extent that was willing to do so. Almost no one seriously disputes that Abbas on whom Israel, the US, and Europe had placed all their bets failed primarily because Arafat retained control of much of the security apparatus, and that Arafat wanted him to fail.

The new prime minister, Ahmed Qurei, clearly will fare no better, since he, if anything, has been trying to garner more power for Arafat, not less. Under these circumstances, the idea of exiling Arafat is gaining currency, but the standard objection is that he will be as much or more of a problem when free to travel the world than he is locked up in Ramallah.

If only three countries Britain, France, and Germany joined the US in a total boycott of Arafat this would not be the case. If these countries did not speak with Arafat, it would not matter much who did, and however much a local Palestinian leader would claim to consult with Arafat, his power would be gone.

But such a boycott will not happen. Only now, after more than 800 Israelis have died in three years of suicide bombings and other terrorist attacks, has Europe finally decided that Hamas is a terrorist organization. How much longer will it take before it cuts off Arafat? Yet Israel cannot accept a situation in which Arafat blocks any Palestinian break with terrorism, whether from here or in exile. Therefore, we are at another point in our history at which the diplomatic risks of defending ourselves are exceeded by the risks of not doing so.

Such was the case in the Six Day War, when Israel was forced to launch a preemptive attack or accept destruction. And when Menachem Begin decided to bomb the Iraqi nuclear reactor in 1981. And when Israel launched Operation Defensive Shield in Palestinian cities after the Passover Massacre of 2002. In each case, Israel tried every fashion of restraint, every plea to the international community to take action that would avoid the need for "extreme" measures, all to no avail. When the breaking point arrives, there is no point in taking half-measures. If we are going to be condemned in any case, we might as well do it right.

Arafat's death at Israel's hands would not radicalize Arab opposition to Israel; just the opposite. The current jihad against us is being fueled by the perception that Israel is blocked from taking decisive action to defend itself.

Arafat's survival and power are a test of the proposition that it is possible to pursue a cause through terror and not have that cause rejected by the international community. Killing Arafat, more than any other act, would demonstrate that the tool of terror is unacceptable, even against Israel, even in the name of a Palestinian state. Arafat does not just stand for terror, he stands for the refusal to make peace with Israel under any circumstances and within any borders.

In this respect, there is no distinction, beyond the tactical, between him and Hamas. Europe's refusal to utterly reject him condemns Palestinians, no less than Israelis, to endless war and dooms the possibility of the two-state solution the world claims to seek.

While the prospect of a Palestinian power vacuum is feared by some, the worst of all worlds is what exists now: Terrorists attack Israel at will under the umbrella of legitimacy provided by Arafat. Hamas would not be able to fill a post-Arafat vacuum; on the contrary, Hamas would lose the cover it has today.

A word must be said here about the most common claim made by those who would not isolate Arafat, let alone kill him: that he is the elected leader of the Palestinian people. Even if Arafat was chosen in a truly free election (when does his term end?), which we would dispute, this does not close the question of his legitimacy.

Whom the Palestinians choose to lead them is none of our business, provided it is a free choice, and provided they do not opt for leaders who choose terror and aggression. So long as the Palestinians choose such a leadership, it should be held no more immune to counterattack by Israel than the Taliban and Saddam Hussein were by the United States.

We complain that a double standard is applied to us, and it is. But we cannot complain when we apply that double standard to ourselves. Arafat's survival, under our watchful eyes, is living testimony to our tolerance of that double standard. If we want another standard to be applied, we must begin by applying it ourselves.

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Before you reject the idea out of hand, realize that Arafat is to Israel what bin Laden is to the United States. We have claimed the right to kill him as a terrorist and a murderer, and Israel can make the same claim on Arafat. He has directed an infantida that has killed hundreds of innocent Israelis and then hid behind international perception when Israel demands that the murder stop. Israel has shown enormous restraint. When Palestinian civilians are killed in the process of destroying terrorism, Israel mourns. When Israeli civilians are killed by suicide bombers acting under Arafat's direction, Palestinians celebrate. - Starkist

carrot red
09-12-2003, 05:19 AM
As much as I'm all for hunting down terrorists (all of them) and eliminating them, I draw the line when it comes to a head of state, be he a terrorist or not.
And like it or not, Arafat is the head of the Palestinian authority.
Yes, he fouled all the peace plans ever devised.
Yes, he stole the Palestinian cause and made it that of the sole faction that follows him (that of Hamas.)
Yes, he controls all the members of his so-called government.
But it's not a "smart" solution, IMHO.

Daarkseid
09-12-2003, 05:28 AM
I'm sorry, but the surest way to ensure the safety of further Palestinians and Israelis is to simply forcefully remove the Israelis and settle them as far away from the holy land as possible.

And whoever would have the resolve to do that would surely draw the wrath of Israeli's who had fought so long and hard to have their own state and to hold onto it.

Assassinating Arafat won't stop the Palistinians from conducting further attacks on Israel. And Palistinian statehood won't ensure the ceasing of such attacks, so long as Israel remains. Even if Palestine was given complete control over Jerusalem.

Thats just how it is. People are shit heads.

Edit: And expelling the Israeli's might not work either.. I'm sure some Palistinian, hateful over some loss incurred by Israel's defensive tactics against terrorism, would make his way over to wherever the Israelis would be relocated, and blow something up.

slothman
09-12-2003, 06:08 AM
[warning Israel-neutral] First Many of the things Israel does could also be terrorist acts. I know you don't like me saying that because Israel is Jewish and they never did anything wrong plus have of them were killed 60 years ago so they should even get revenge. Second if a person commits a crime, whether terror or burglary, they should be punished accordingly. Including having others commit crimes. I don't know exacly what Arafat did, but I do know that many, many Americas better though of than him did more. Second any I'm of the "live and let live" group that doesn't interfere with another nation unless it threatens us. However Arafat got into power doesn't affect if we should arrest him or not. Second Israel deserves the land as much as the Muslams do religously speaking. So regardless of what happes to Arafat or the Hamas attacks on Israel will continue until both sides/religions can administer the land together or peacfully. Just like attacks will continues on us, though they are rare and will be negligble in either case, if we eliminate Al Qaeda. Peace will not be in the Middle East until the U.S stops unilaterally helping Israel and killing and removing due process, read Gatmo Bay, Israel's enemies. Including facts such as Israels possesion of nuclear weapons, a known fact. Ask for cites if you want or google (lowercase since common verb) them. Israel also was not forced to pre-emptive start a war. I believe in fact that is incorrect grammar. Killing Arafat would not demonstrate that terror is bad to people that like him, I personally don't think of him as any better than Israel though. Remember one man's terrorist is another's freedom fighter.
Now for sites I wanted to put in:
http://www.us-israel.org/jsource/UN/usvetoes.html
http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2003/6/28/17448/1750

Starkist
09-15-2003, 03:51 AM
Originally posted by carrot red
As much as I'm all for hunting down terrorists (all of them) and eliminating them, I draw the line when it comes to a head of state, be he a terrorist or not.

I know it's a late response, but I suddenly realized that this applies to Saddam Hussein even moreso than Arafat. There is no nation of Palestine, the people who identify themselves as Palestinians are merely Arabs who left Israel fifty years ago. Arafat himself is Egyptian. Anyhow, Hussein was the leader of a government that has stood for many years, yet we have shown no qaulms in hunting him down to kill him. Do you support the hunt and possible assassination of Saddam Hussein?

SATAN
09-15-2003, 04:00 AM
Just kill him!
He is the head of terrorist and the world is better of with less and i would somthing to do again in this lausy job of mine!

OK!

carrot red
09-15-2003, 01:06 PM
Originally posted by Starkist
I know it's a late response, but I suddenly realized that this applies to Saddam Hussein even more so than Arafat. There is no nation of Palestine, the people who identify themselves as Palestinians are merely Arabs who left Israel fifty years ago. Arafat himself is Egyptian. Anyhow, Hussein was the leader of a government that has stood for many years, yet we have shown no qualms in hunting him down to kill him.
I already discussed this. I thought it was with you, but apparently not. The difference is:
-We declared war on Iraq.
-The President gave Saddam an ultimatum to leave the country.
-Past that deadline, yes, we tried to kill him.
-We were at war against him and his regime.
So, it was totally legitimate.

To the best of my knowledge, none of this applies to Arafat (whom I consider to be the scum of the earth) nor to the Palestinians.


Originally posted by Starkist
Do you support the hunt and possible assassination of Saddam Hussein?
In a war, there is no such thing as an assassination. He will be hunted down and eventually killed; and would be written off as a war casualty.

deathbyhokie
09-15-2003, 01:15 PM
Originally posted by carrot red

-We declared war on Iraq.
-The President gave Saddam an ultimatum to leave the country.
-Past that deadline, yes, we tried to kill him.
-We were at war against him and his regime.
So, it was totally legitimate.

To the best of my knowledge, none of this applies to Arafat (whom I consider to be the scum of the earth) nor to the Palestinians.

-i'm pretty sure the isreali's have declared "war" on anything they consider to be a terrorist organization.
-arafat got his warning when the isreali's barricaded him in his compound a while back for a week or so

the difference between sadaam and arafat is only who it is who's after them. it's the same concepts at the core of the issue

thePHeffect
09-15-2003, 06:41 PM
test

Starkist
09-15-2003, 06:54 PM
My goodness... just reading the inherent stupidity in that last post has caused my IQ to drop a few points! "Israel is the most paranoid country in the world" ? Wouldn't you be paranoid if the world was trying to KILL YOU? How many times have the Jews been opressed? How many nations have tried to rid themselves of the Jewish problem? How many conspiracies start and end with evil zionists? How many holocausts must they endure?